Categorized | Mark Timmons

Is there a plan?

Mercifully, for Dodger fans, the World Series is over.  At this juncture, I would be hard-pressed to say that the two teams in the series were not the best two organizations in baseball.    They both took different paths to get there, but both teams have one thing in common: Not many long-term contracts.

The Cardinals have four players under what I would call “Long-term Contracts:

  • Matt Holiday -3 Years/$51 Million
  • Yadier Molina – 4 Years/$58.8 Million
  • Adam Wainwright – 5 Years/$97.5 Million
  • Allen Craig – 4 Years/$28.25 Million

The Red Sox have no players they owe past 2 years.  Think about the flexibility that brings.  They can change the team in an instant.

The Cardinals let Albert Pujols, who at the time was arguably one of the TOP 5 players in baseball walk, because they feared decline and it came as he hit 32 and especially 33.  Can he still be relevant at 34?  We will find out, but he’s not THAT GUY anymore.  Father time takes his toll.  The Cardinals made sure they got value for losing him – Michael Wacha who has a brilliant future ahead of him.  They signed a stud aging hitter in Carlos Beltran for just one year.

Contrast that with the Dodgers Long-Term Contracts:

  • Adrian Gonzalez – 5 Years/$110 Million – Age 33 next year
  • Carl Crawford – 4 Years/$85.8 Million – Age 33 next year
  • Matt Kemp – 5 Years/$107 Million – Age 30 next year
  • Andre Ethier – 4 Years/$69 Million – Age 32 next year
  • Zach Greinke – 5 Years/$128 Million – Age 31 next year
  • Hyun-Jin Ryu – 5 Years/$31.5 Million – Age 27 next year

I haven’t included Puig,because he can opt out (and will) in two years and the Dodgers will have to outbid everyone.  I also haven’t included the 10 Year/$300 Million deal to King Clayton.  The Dodgers also have almost $54 million in payroll due in 2014 to Brandon League, Josh Beckett, Chad Billingsley and Hanley Ramirez – all over 30 next year.

So when I hear that they should sign Robinson Cano who will get $200 to $250 million over 5-7 years, I want to puke.  Cano will be 33 years old in the second year of that deal.  Those long-term deals seldom work out.  Ask the Yankees.

Pujols declined in his 33rd year – wanna bet Gonzo and Crawford decline somewhat or even a lot next year?  The Dodgers could trade Ethier and Crawford if they ate about half their deals, but it might be worth it.  They are younger with Guerrero at 2B.  Dee Gordon is learning the OF (contrary to reports that he would play CF exclusively, he played LF yesterday).  I hear that some scouts don’t think he has the instincts to play CF.  I can’t say.  I haven’t seen him there.

The Dodgers do need to get younger.  As much as I would like to have Choo, I think it is likely a bad move – he will command 5 Years at $100+ Million.  No thank you!

At what point do you start to trust your youngsters?  Joc Pederson, Ross Stripling, Zach Lee, Yimi Garcia, Chris Anderson, Chris Reed, Onelki Garcia, Tom Windle and Jose Dominguez… even Corey Seager is closer than you think.  He’s at .160 but has 2 HR – #1 MLB prospect Byron Buxton is hitting .231.  The AFL is a different animal – players work on certain aspects of their games, so the stats can frequently be misleading.

I hear rumblings that Hanley may be willing to move to 3B, if the Dodgers were to get a defensive wizard at SS.  Elvis Andrus has a big deal, but is 25 years old and is good defensively – maybe Big Mac could get his OB% to the next level.  I think it’s likely the Rangers will trade Profar or Andrus this winter.  Could Ethier, Crawford and other prospects get one of them in a 3 or 4 way deal?

A lot hinges on Guerrero – can he hit .260 with 20 HR and play good defense?  That’s all the Dodgers need from him, but can he do it?  We simply don’t know.

There is a lot of work to be done.  The Dodgers spending got them close, but the Cardinals and Red Sox team-building plan won out.   The Dodgers need to have a plan like theirs.  Congratulations to both organizations.

I hope we can say the same thing next year for the Dodgers.



About Mark Timmons

When you see the invisible, you can do the impossible!

58 Responses to “Is there a plan?”

  1. Watford Dodger says:

    Mark – a very good point very well made. We are a little hamstrung by those huge long contracts but perhaps we are in a slightly different situation to most other teams in that we have more $$$ and can swallow some of the bad deals and free up some spots for our young emerging talent. After all it was a young Puig who ignited our season. Give youth a chance.

  2. Badger says:

    Good post.

    Money has less to do with it for the Dodgers. I keep saying that. I do understand the age thing and I agree with it – to a point. Our studs are not that old, but they will be in a couple of years. Kemp, Ramirez and Gonzalez – the middle of our order – should have 2 good years left. We are built for NOW. WE were the best team this year! NOT the Red Sox and certainly not the Cardinals. I do not believe it is too late for this group. Add what is needed and tee it up again. If it don’t work next year? ……. Could be time to regroup.

  3. Jimbo says:

    We’ve heard talk of Ethier for Kinsler for months. What about Ethier for Andrus? I read somewhere that the Rangers would rather trade Andrus instead of Profar. I was going to post about that earlier but it’s a pipe dream scenario unless Hanley is willing to move off of SS. And we all want happy Hanley. The other thing I wonder is ‘IF’ Hanley will move from SS would he move to 2B and have Guerrero play 3B. In my opinion 2B would be easier on Hanley’s body.

  4. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    “There is a lot of work to be done. The Dodgers spending got them close, but the Cardinals and Red Sox team-building plan won out. The Dodgers need to have a plan like theirs. Congratulations to both organizations.”

    Yes there is a lot to be done. And yes, the Dodgers spending got close. And were it not for the rash of injuries (none age related), the Dodgers would have clearly run all over the Cards, and may well have won it all. However, that’s past history, and no use dwelling on it. But what I do object to is your reference to the Cardinals and Red Sox team building plans, as if the Dodgers don’t have one. In fact, the Dodgers do have one. Unfortunately it wasn’t put into effect until the Guggs purchase of the team in May of 2012. And even then, it took several months for it to actually be implemented. McCourt destroyed the Dodgers farm system, and made them completely irrelevant on the international scene, where in 2011 the Dodgers were DEAD LAST among the 30 MLB teams on what they spent on the international market. That sort of thing is not something you recover from in a season or two. Since then the Dodgers have brought in Bob Engle, Gerry Hunsicker and Pat Corrales to fix that situation, and to my knowledge have doubled the scouting staff. Problem is, most of the players being signed internationally are probably 16-18 years old, so don’t expect immediate results out of that. But still we have Puig, Urias, and Guerrero, only the first those yet tested at the MLB level. And I’m sure there are others whose names will begin popping up over the next several years.

    Puig CANNOT opt out in 2 years, at least that’s what I read. According to Cot’s he can opt in to arbitration (not free agency) after 3 years of MLB service time. And according to Baseball-Reference he becomes arbitration eligible in 2016, and the earliest he can become a free agent is 2019.

    Look at my post at the end of the last thread regarding the ages of some players. Close, but not exactly what was posted above.

    Gonzalez was born 5/8/82, so he’ll turn 32 next season, not 33.

    Crawford was born 8/5/81, so you’re correct that he will turn 33. But it won’t be until late in the season.

    Kemp was born 9/23/84, so again you’re correct, he will turn 30 next season. But like Crawford it won’t be until late in the season, very late.

    Zach Greinke was born 10/21/83, so you’re technically correct that he will turn 31 next year. But only well into the playoffs, assuming the Dodgers get there.

    I’m not suggesting the Dodgers should sign Cano, but he was born 10/22/82, which will make him 31 to begin next year, and 32 to begin his second year, and he will only turn 33 during the playoffs of his second year.

    Like I said above, it will take time before the Dodgers farm system is in full gear. But there are, it appears, some good prospects. If Ethier is traded, that leaves us with Puig, Kemp and Crawford in the outfield. I think Crawford is capable of putting together a good year again, and maybe, based on what we saw near the end of the year, with a bit more power. Kemp right now is a huge question mark, but I wouldn’t count him out just yet. The shoulder surgery he had is the same one that Agon and Hanley seem to have recovered from, and in both cases the power returned in the second year after the surgery, which is the year Kemp is headed into. His legs are another matter, and we’ll just have to wait on that one. However, due to his shoulder surgery last year, I believe that his workouts last winter were less than optimal. That should change this winter. And if he’s ready, I have no problem with Joc Pederson stepping in if needed.

    Billingsley and Hanley will be 30 next year, not “over” 30. League will be 31. Not exactly greybeards. I’d like us to be able to move League, but it’s possible he might even be useful in a less demanding role. He might be a good reason for the Dodgers to sign Tanaka who is reputed to have the best splitter in the world (not sure anybody really knows that). Maybe Tanaka could pass on a few pointers to League that would enable to latter to find the one he lost. Stranger things have happened.

    Assuming he comes back OK, I believe that Billingsley could be very valuable out of the pen. And if League doesn’t cut it next year, his contract is not so huge that the Dodgers couldn’t eat it, and replace him with Bills. And as far as Billingsley contract goes, he’s owed $12 million in 2014, and there’s a club option of $14 million in 2015 or a $3 million buyout.

    If the Dodgers could work out a deal to get Andrus or Profar and move Hanley to 3B I’d be all for it. As I’m sure you know, I’ve been preaching getting younger. And I’ve also made it clear that I don’t think Hanley can remain at short much longer, if at all. And getting younger is something Colletti has mentioned. It’s also a reason I’d like to see a kid like Yimi Garcia get a chance to replace Belisario. In fact, if the Dodgers can trade Belisario, I hope they do. If not, he’s a candidate for me for the Dodgers to part ways with, by whatever means possible.

    Regarding Corey Seager being closer than we think, I’m not sure exactly what you’re thinking. If he can get it going against more advanced pitching, I don’t see him in Dodger Stadium until 2016 at the earliest (maybe a September callup in 2015). He was only 19 last year, which would make him 22 in 2016. Anything before that is probably wishful thinking. And he still has a lot to prove before we can even depend on him for anything. And really, if Hanley moved to 3B, and shortstop was filled by a player like Andrus or Profar, even 2016 would be a bit optimistic. But those are the kind of problems the Dodgers need to have.

    OK, this year it’s the Cardinals way or the Red Sox’s way. Last year it was the Midgets way. And what happened to that? Let’s be clear. The names and the scripts change every year. Please tell me the last time a team repeated. It is perfectly clear to anyone watching this thing closely that the Dodgers have a plan. But it’s a plan still in its early stages, and it’s a plan that got us within a couple of wins away from the World Series. From my vantage point the Dodgers plan is working just fine. Remove the injuries and it may well have gotten them a world championship. But since that wasn’t the case, I think it is undeniable that the plan is moving them in that direction. There are all kinds of twists and turns in these things, but that’s the same for every team. Right now I’m satisfied that my team has a plan in place, and is headed in the right direction. There are 30 MLB teams. Only two of them went further than us. That can change in an instant.

  5. Idaho al says:

    Good article Mark. I do think the Dodgers have a plan. I believe they think they must develop the farm system. The farm system was depleted by McCourt, and Colletti did not help it by trading some of our good young players. For the Dodgers to be relevant this year, they had to do what they did with the trade with Boston. I did not think it was a good trade, but they had to bring in established ball players who could play right now. I believe the players we have now have two to three good years left. That will give us enough time to develop the farm system. That is why I think going after Tanaka is so important. We can get him with out losing some of our farm system. I would not trade for Price.

    The contract with League was a terrible contract. I said it right away, because he lost the closer job in Seattle, because he was inconsistent. I think the contracts with League, Uribe and Either were not good contracts. That is why I still have reservations about Colletti.

    I still do not trust our medical staff. I wish the Dodgers would clean house We lost Sue, but more need to go.

  6. Quasimodo says:

    The 2013 is dead but the body is still warm. I don’t have anything to offer that hasn’t been covered above. It seems like everyone is on the same page for the most part….even Coletti. I’ve got no argument.

  7. Bobby says:

    Couple of moves today: Dodgers decline options on both Mark Ellis and Capuano

    MAYBE Ellis returns at a reduced rate? Otherwise, I think both of them are gone.

  8. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    FYI, Dodgers declined options on Capuano and Mark Ellis.

    Can’t say it’s a surprise.

  9. Watford Dodger says:

    Good point Idaho Al – as I said before the biggest problem we have is with our terrible soft tissue injuries in relatively young men. Broken bones are different but we have too many muscular problems. If we get our best team out there most days we are good. These are not old men. They should not be missing half the season to strains & pulls. We cannot plan for a season with so many question marks over player’s fitness.
    The only answer with League is to DFA him.

  10. Badger says:

    The Dodgers are not that old. Not yet. They’re also not that deep.

    I think we are beginning to repeat ourselves on here. Maybe that’s a sign of old age? Management has a plan. That plan is to win it all next year. Get our current vets healthy, add both a quality starter and a decent bat, improve the bench and we are ready to go.

    I also think we are beginning to repeat ourselves in here…….

  11. Bobbie17 says:

    Kemp’s injury gutted what there was of a plan. As good as he was, he could have carried this team for several years. He was one of those needles in a haystack that good teams get once in a while. So now we have huge gap in talent and age. From what I see in the farm system, there still isn’t much there. Focus must be on pitchers, starters and relievers. If Puig can keep it going, he can fill in the middle of the order. Pitchers and Puig, with a healthy Ramirez, and we should be ok. I hope Ramirez gets the back taken care of in the off season. He can’t keep fighting the disc/hamstring issue. Although I am not a fan of doctors, a “simple” surgery might keep him going through 162 games.

  12. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    Of course we’re repeating ourselves. The story hasn’t changed, nor have the solutions.

  13. Bobby says:

    Oh yeah?? Well Kershaw is better than Koufax!

    So there

  14. Mark_Timmons says:

    Through age 25 he absolutely is! I\’m glad you guys finally agree! I was beginning to worry about comprehension.

  15. Quasimodo says:

    My new yellow water is coming through the pipes carbonated.

  16. Badger says:

    What I also read was 30 wins, 300 wins, greatest Dodger pitcher of all time…….

    First get 166 wins, a couple of Championships, a few no hitters, throw in a perfect game….. I’ll stop there.

    I don’t think yellow water is a good thing. Carbonation isn’t all that bad though.

    Any more news? Tomorrow could be big.

  17. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    I agree with Bobby, Kershaw is better than Koufax, NOW! Then again, the 77 year old Sandy is still in pretty good shape.

    Comprehension??????????? Well, only ONE (singular) of us commented that Kershaw was better than Koufax, and I’m not even sure if that was a serious comment. So how does that qualify as us “guys” (plural). Reading is Fundamental.

  18. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    Oh, and as regards Koufax, count me in on what Badger said.

  19. Mark_Timmons says:

    So, let me get this correct – some of you believe that up to age 25, Koufax was better than Kershaw currently is at age 25?

    Is that what you think?

    You guys never answer.

    1. I have predicted that when it is all over, Kershaw will be the best Dodger pitcher of all time.

    2. I have also said that Koufax’s last 4 years will never likely be duplicated.

    3. I have also said that at age 25, Koufax was not as good as Kershaw. Get your quote right!

    Now, you are free to disagree with #1 because it hasn’t happened yet. Maybe you disagree with #2… or not. But if you disagree with #3, you are delusional. Check the stats. Oh, and Koufax didn’t have a no-hitter until he was 26.

    Some of you guys have issues with reality.


    • Jimbo says:

      1) Will be nice if it comes true.
      2) Agree.
      3) Agree.

      Anybody remember when there was talk of why we couldn’t develop a pitcher as good as tiny Tim? How’d that turn out?

  20. Idaho al says:

    Mark I agree with you. Kershaw at age 25 is better than Koufax at age 25. Kershaw certainly has the potential to be better than Koufax, but it remains to be seen. If he stays healthy, he will be better.

  21. Idaho al says:

    Here is what I would like to see happen. First sit down and talk to Ramierz and see if he will move to third base. If he will, then move him to third. I agree with Jimbo, trade Crawford for Andrus. Crawford has to go to an American League team, because of the DH. May have to eat part of Crawford’s salary. I would give Gordon one more shot at making it in LF. Keep either SVS or Pederson as back-up in case Gordon does not make it. Keep Ellis as back up at second, just in case Guerrero does not make it. Go after Tanaka. Fill the 5th spot with Billingsly, Beckett, Fife or Magill. Work on filling out the bull pen and the bench. That would be my team.

  22. Badger says:

    1. NO WAY

    2. and 3. – who cares. Doesn’t mean a thing.

    Here’s another stat for we reading impaired, by age 25 Koufax had already pitched in the World Series and had a 1.00 ERA and 0.667 WHIP. He also had a Championship ring.

    Kershaw is a stud. He has pitched very well for us, won a few games, got a Cy, and in the biggest game of the year, an elimination game, he got eliminated. Like I said, I’ll wait. Kershaw gets a no hitter next year, and wins a World Series Championship, then he is at least on pace. To be better, he only needs 4 WS Championships, 3 more Cy’s, 3 MVP’s, 5 WS victories, 5 no hitters, another 1200 IP, another 1100 K’s and for those of us who care about individual awards, there is this list upon which Kershaw will need to surpass:

    1962 NL pitching_title
    1963 NL Babe Ruth Award
    1963 NL MVP
    1963 ML Major League Player of the Year
    1963 NL Triple Crown
    1963 NL TSN Pitcher of the Year
    1963 ML Cy Young
    1963 ML WS MVP
    1963 NL pitching_title
    1964 NL TSN Pitcher of the Year
    1964 NL pitching_title
    1965 ML Major League Player of the Year
    1965 NL Babe Ruth Award
    1965 NL TSN Pitcher of the Year
    1965 ML Cy Young
    1965 ML WS MVP
    1965 NL Triple Crown
    1965 NL pitching_title
    1966 NL Triple Crown
    1966 ML Hutch Award
    1966 NL pitching_title
    1966 NL TSN Pitcher of the Year
    1966 ML Cy Young

    When all of that is done by Kershaw, then YES! he will be crowned Greatest Dodger Pitcher of All Time!!

    Until that time, better at age 25.

    Let’s get him signed and then we can wait for all of the above to happen. Sure, he has a shot………

  23. Badger says:

    And there is this comforting fact pilfered from MSTI:

    Corey Seager has never lost the deciding game of a World Series.

    So, that pick is safe from criticism. For the moment anyway.

  24. Badger says:

    As you guys know, I am a HUGE proponent of speed at the top of the lineup. I want speed up the middle on defense and I want speed to get over 1200 plate appearances on my team. That is why I wanted Michael Bourne and Carl Crawford up that many times in my lineup.

    So, with that in mind, would somebody please read this and give me a full report. I tried to read it and got lost… not enough caffeine yet I suppose. Maybe not enough brain cells left.

  25. Idaho al says:

    Badger-I agree with you on speed. That is why I would have Gordon and Andrus at the top of the line up. Followed by Ramierz, Agon, Kemp, Either, Guerrero and Ellis. Not a bid line-up.

  26. Gonzo says:

    Good post Mark. Here’s how I see it though. The youth movement will start by 2017 when most of the current contracts will expire. To me this is an ideal situation for the team since most of these players are in the final part of their prime sans Ethier who will be traded. The future is now and will be brighter come 2017 as our farm should be paying dividens.

  27. Watford Dodger says:

    Just want to correct something I said the other day – Chase Hadley is not a free agent this season – he’s still under team control for one more year but would be available by trade.
    I’ve been looking at the 3rd basemen available as an upgrade on Uribe and the cupboard is pretty bare. I really think he would be a big improvement especially if returning to anything like his 2012 form after injury & is a good age. Would probably have to give up a couple of prospects. He has a great glove too.

  28. Badger says:

    We got Seager and he is the second coming of, I don’t know, pick a third baseman. Maybe we could trade him to the Padres for Headley. Anybody interested?

    Agree about the year our system might actually produce somebody. Cupboard was emptied by the McCockroach, so, it will take a few years to re-stock. We’ll get there. In the mean time, we need to take advantage of the still <30 studs we have hanging around. I like getting Andrus. Or one of the other great young SS since we don't have one. Not sure what to do about Gordon. He seemed to be able to hit and bunt and steal and score all the way through AAA. Whahapin to him? What a weapon he would be if only he could learn how to get on base. That kind of speed changes things. He could play lf and be valuable IF he could just get on at .333.. .383 would be a lot better, but, let's set the bar low. As was pointed out in that article, I think it was that article, Lopes and Wills didn't figure it out until after 27. Maybe Gordon will too. Maybe he needs to figure it out somewhere else though. Ion'tkno.

  29. Gonzo says:

    I saw that Jason Kybel was let go by CLE. I think he’d be a nice player to have off the bench/pinch hit that can play the corners and 1B. I’ve never like Gordon.

  30. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    I’m probably amongst the lonely who still think Gordon can hit. He hit well when he first came up, and then was awful last year. This year, he never really go a chance for any regular play, but did show a new awareness of the strike zone both with the Dodgers and at ALBQ. And it didn’t help that he had that thumb injury last year. If anything, it slowed his progress.

    I like the idea of Gordon being a sub off the bench. It’s apparent that at present he can’t be trusted on defense at short. But from what I’ve heard, he’s better at 2B and enjoys playing there. If he can learn to play the outfield I think he can become a very valuable piece off the bench, not just a pinch runner. It may well be that all he needs is to ease himself back into a big league role, and we might just see that potential begin to make itself apparent. He’s mastering the strike zone, and just maybe he’ll also begin to master the art of bunting. Besides, what’s to lose? If he doesn’t measure up it wouldn’t be all that hard to jettison him during the season. Or does anyone think picking up another utility guy is all that difficult during the season.

    Seager may well turn out to be very good, and maybe not. Whatever the case, he’s not likely to be ready before 2016, when he’ll be all of 22. And maybe it will be after that. What’s the hurry? In the meantime, I’d love it if we went after a young (25), experienced fast guy like Andrus. I’d even take his so-called bad year in 2013.

    Even Mark said that Hanley might be willing to move over to 3B if the Dodgers could get a good young shortstop. As for me, you all know that I never bought into the good Hanley bad Hanley thing, and have always thought that Hanley would ultimately be better served playing 3B rather than the more demanding shortstop. Maybe after his injury riddled 2013, and because he’s happy and can taste a championship in LA, Hanley has become more amenable to the move. And just guessing, perhaps the Dodgers in private talks have indicated to him that they would be more likely to consider a long term deal if he was willing to make the move over to 3B.

    And when Seager is finally ready, who says he has to be our third baseman? Maybe Guerrero is a complete flop and Seager can play 2B. Maybe even 1B, or a corner outfield spot. Or maybe Seager becomes a really valuable piece in a trade that brings us something else of value. I don’t know about anyone else around here, but I have no problems with the Dodgers having a surplus of talent. And goodness, the kid will turn only 20 next year. There is time, and we never know what the future might bring.

  31. Bobby says:

    Seattle didn’t pick up the option on Franklin Gutierrez.

    He might be a nice 4th OF option. Can play great D, and is pretty fast.

  32. Badger says:

    Seager is 6’4″ and by the time he turns 22 he should weigh over 220. Don’t see him at 2nd base. His value will be as a corner infielder. No hurry, but we need some + WAR numbers out of that position while our now 30 year olds are still producing. Remember, we are in win now mode.

    Agree about Gordon. I am on his side, but that clock is ticking down.

  33. Watford Dodger says:

    Agree with that Badger – this team is for winning now.
    Need more from 2nd & 3rd if that is going to happen.

  34. Badger says:

    I believe the Dodgers will have patience with Guerrero. Mark Ellis’ stats were very interesting this year. He hit .270 with a .323 OBP. With just a 92 OPS+, he managed a 3 WAR. I don’t know how good Guerrero is, nobody does for sure, but I am thinking the Dodgers figure the much younger second baseman will figure it out and hit with considerably more punch than did Ellis. I think it’s safe to assume that position has been upgraded.

    Which brings us to 3rd base. Peralta or Uribe? Other choices?

  35. jerry says:

    did sandy ever blow a important game…like kershaw.let me know

  36. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    Jerry, he did lose the 2nd game of the 1966 World Series, when he gave up 4 runs in 6 innings. Of course, only one of those runs was earned, and the Dodgers made 6 errors in the game, including 3 by Willie Davis (among them I believe were two dropped fly balls).

    And he lost the first game of the 3 game playoff with the Giants in 1962. But there were extenuating circumstances there as well. That was after being out a couple of months with Reynaud’s Phenomenon, a circulatory ailment that affected his feel for the ball, especially when he tried to throw the curve. Koufax admitted to having almost nothing that day.

    I guess Kershaw’s excuse would be overwork. But the 259 innings he threw this year pale to the 330 or so that Koufax used to throw in the regular season. So I guess if you included the postseason that number went up to 350 or more innings. And of course, there’s Koufax’s 2-0 shutout of the Twins in the 7th game of the 1965 World Series on TWO days rest.

  37. Dodgernut says:

    The analysis of Cardinals players doesn’t take into account the current age of those players. Considering their ages the Dodgers contracts expire earlier hence comparable or better contract time in their prime years.

  38. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    Badger, you may well be correct about Seager ending up in a corner because of his size, but I don’t think having big middle infielders is unprecedented. But I only mentioned 2B as a possibility if Guerrero (or somebody else) doesn’t make it. I’ve never seen Seager play, and I know he’s not expected to remain at short where he is now. But I believe there probably is an outside chance he could play 2B. Probably not likely, but I won’t rule it out until I see the player with my own eyes. But whatever the case, I don’t see the Dodgers shying away from filling any position just because Seager might be the solution there. The object is to win championships, and if Seager is needed and able to win the 3rd base job, then fine. If not, he provides organizational depth, and perhaps could be used elsewhere or be a trade chip that helps us fill another area of need. I’m just not ready to pencil him in anywhere at this time. Still very young, and lots of time to make decisions with respect to his future with the Dodgers. What if Hanley does move to 3B, and continues to remain productive there for the next 5 years? What happens to Seager then. He could move to another position temporarily, and then move to 3B after those 5 years when he’s still only in his mid-20′s. Or maybe the Dodgers come up with another great 3B prospect in the next several years. The possibilities are endless.

  39. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    Forgive me. I said “Giants” above, after promising myself to always refer to them by their proper name, namely “Midgets”. I humbly apologize.

  40. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    This from Peter Gammons.

    I’d do the Tanaka part of this, but probably not the Price part.

  41. Badger says:

    Well there’s your answer Brooklyn. Trade Seager for Price and move Ramirez.

    I don’t do 4 in that trade. Lee and Pederson plus another that isn’t Urias or Seager.

  42. Anonymous says:

    I cannot believe Mattingly hasn’t been given the pink slip yet.


  43. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    Maybe that is my answer. But without seeing all these guys I have a problem with moving all 4. Might be a gem or two among them. But I probably would include 3. Of course, I’m assuming that the Dodgers could handle that huge payroll of pitchers. But I believe that’s a safe assumption.

    Read somewhere today that all MLB teams are going to receive an additional $25 million each when a new MLB TV contract kicks in next year. Also, read something to the effect that the signing of Ryu has resulted in or will result in additional promotional dollars for the Dodgers via agreements with Korean companies. That’s why I believe these high priced deals for foreign talent (e.g., Tanaka) bring with their expense all sorts of revenue opportunities.

    And on the subject of revenue opportunities, we haven’t heard much, if anything, about how Guggs is going to develop the land on which they’re partners with McRoach. I’m sure there are lots of dollars to be made there, and that it figures into their overall long term plans, and their willingness to spend big dollars now to generate big profits later.

    • Badger says:

      I would do 3 too. But I am hesitant to give up on our best 3. Top 2 + another. How about 1 + Gordon and a younger arm?

      You understand the money thing well Brooklyn. These guys know what they’re doing.

      Tanaka. Hai!

  44. Yo! Adrian says:

    1. trade idea
    1) Price and Longoria for Puig, Guerrero, Beckett and 20mil
    2) Joe Mauer for Ethier and AJ Ellis

    2. FA signing
    1) R. Cano (150mil/6yrs)
    2) Choo (100mil/5yrs)
    3) Tanaka (55mil – posting, 65mil/6yrs)
    4) Wilson (20mil/3yrs)

    If all goes like above, the line up will be:

    1.Choo (RF)
    2.Ramirez (SS)
    3.Cano (2B)
    4.Longoria (3B)
    5.Gonzalez (1B)
    6.Kemp (CF)
    7.Mauer (C)
    8.Crawford (LF)

    1. Kershaw 2. Greinke 3. Price 4. Tanaka 5. Ryu
    1. Wilson 2. Jensen 3. Billingsley (from summer) 4. Withrow
    5. C.Reed 6. P.Rod 7. Windle 8. League/Belisario/Howell…etc

  45. Mark_Timmons says:

    I want what he\’s smoking!

  46. Brooklyn Dodger says:


    I seriously doubt if $55 million posting will win the rights to Tanaka. Originally the talk was $60 million+. It’s now beginning to jump up to $80 million, and maybe it will go to $100 million or more. Keep in mind that the Yankees are involved, and that the posting fee doesn’t count towards the luxury tax. If the Yankees are really serious then they know they’ll have to beat out the Dodgers, and the sames goes for the Dodgers having to beat out the Yankees. This could get really ridiculous, with numbers we haven’t seen before. And it’s all the more reason for the Dodgers to stay away from Cano and Choo. The Dodgers have lots of money, but so do the Yankees. In fact, I believe the Yankees have serious dollars coming off the payroll this year, more so than the Dodgers. I’m not even going to guess what it will cost to get the rights to Tanaka. And because the numbers could get ridiculous, I’m only cautiously optimistic that the Dodgers will prevail, but not fully certain. The Yankees could represent a very large obstacle, unless of course, they think that the Dodgers might go after Cano if they don’t get Tanaka. But rest assured, the Dodgers will not go after both, and Choo on top of that.

    And there’s no way I trade Puig. He’s the first in a long line of prospects that I expect to see over the next several years, and is part of a long term Dodger plan to build from within. I don’t think they’ll stray from that with a player of his caliber. And I also don’t see them trading Guerrero, and for the same reasoning I just gave for Puig. Longoria is good, but no better than a healthy Hanley would be at 3B.

    Just checked Mauer’s stats, and it looks like he’s still very productive. So unless the Twins want to unload his contract (of which I don’t know the details) for Ethier’s, I can’t see them making that deal. Mauer’s a hometown hero in the Twin cities. It would take more than Ethier and A.J. Ellis.

    Not sure how you assume Reed and Windle are on the Dodgers staff. Possible one of them is, very improbable that both are. Also a strong possibility that neither are on the staff. Looks to me like a prognostication made while wearing deep blue Dodger glasses.

  47. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    “I want what he’s smoking.” – Mark

    “Yoiks.” – Badger

    You guys hit it on the nose. No need for all that verbiage I just posted.

  48. Badger says:

    At least Yo is engaged in the process. I give him an A for his effort. The lineup isn’t bad, but it’s expensive and I don’t see 170 games out of any of those guys.
    Give me something LIKE that with Puig and Guerrero still in it.

    More Red Sox today. Nauseating.

    Can Jed get done what needs to get done without getting swindled in the process? He never has filled me with confidence.

    Did Donnie get his security blanket yet?

  49. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    Well, I believe Kasten said he would provide us with more details after the World Series. Of course, he didn’t say how long after the World Series. I’m guessing we will start to here some stuff as early as this coming week. Have a feeling though that the Dodgers probably don’t want to shake things up too much now, so I suppose that Donnie might get his security blanket. But I’ve been wrong before, so don’t bet the house on this. Could be that the Dodgers won’t make a Donnie announcement until they decide who the new bench coach will be. Perhaps Donnie will even have some input into that. Maybe they’re waiting to see what happens with Wallach.

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