Categorized | Mark Timmons

Rants & Raves

Rants & Raves
  • Tony Jackson of EspnLosAngeles has the latest about Logan White.

    Maury Wills, Don Newcombe and Logan White

  • Will Tim Wallach be on Mattingly’s staff or a manager somewhere else?
  • According to Ken Gurnick of Dodgers.com, the Dodgers announced 2011 season-ticket pricing Monday, with nearly 80 percent of stadium seat pricing staying the same or being reduced down for the fourth consecutive season.
  • Boy are the rumors are flying about who the Dodgers will trade, sign and non-tender! Officially, 106% of the rumors are wrong.
  • My take on who gets traded and non-tendered:

Russ Martin could be a non-tender candidate.  Even though his offense has declined for 3 years, he stands to make $6-7 mil in arbitration.  Ellis and Barajas would cost less than 1/3 of that.  Is Martin worth that much more?  He is admired by his teammates, but that goes only so far.  I think My Favorite Martin is gone!

James Loney and Jon Broxton.  I know there is a market for Loney, but I’m not sure there is for J-Brox.  St. Louis could use a new closer and Dave Duncan might just be the guy to turn him into a super-closer.  In my opinion, closers are overrated.  The Twins lost Joe Nathan early in the season and made do.  Broxton is replaceable.  Here’s what I see however:  Loney and Broxton will make $14 mil between them next season.  $14 mil would get Adam Dunn or Adrian Beltre.  I would opt for Beltre, but you might like Dunn better.  Either way, I think the Dodgers would be better by signing one of them and trading Broxton and Loney, with the idea of getting a starting pitcher in return.  Losing Loney, Broxton and Martin would save the Dodgers $21 mil and I beleive that a starting pitcher and a slugger would benefit them more.  If the Dodgers were to get Beltre, I wouldn’t be opposed to platooning Gibbons and Blake at 1B.

About Mark Timmons

When you see the invisible, you can do the impossible!

34 Responses to “Rants & Raves”

  1. Ray says:

    LA Farm System Is Solid according to BA:

    Assistant editor Conor Glassey went through all of the Top 20s and sorted the players by their current organization. He counted each individual player once, so the Angels, for example, didn’t get credit for two prospects when Mike Trout ranked No. 1 in both the California and Midwest leagues. Here’s how each farm system did:

    Rangers 18 Astros 9
    Rays 15 Twins 8
    Dodgers 14 White Sox 8
    Mariners 14 Mets 7
    Red Sox 14 Brewers 6
    Rockies 14 Cubs 6
    Yankees 14 Indians 6
    Blue Jays 13 Marlins 6
    Royals 12 Tigers 6
    Angels 11 Cardinals 5
    Braves 11 Nationals 5
    Diamondbacks 11 Athletics 4
    Giants 11 Orioles 4
    Padres 11
    Phillies 10
    Pirates 10
    Reds 10

    It’s not a perfect way to evaluate a farm system, but there’s a correlation between the number of Top 20 Prospects and the strength of an organization. Most of the leaders on that list are going to rank near the top of our offseason farm system ratings.

    • Badger says:

      That’s interesting. Fanhouse had us at 25th in January.

      http://mlb.fanhouse.com/2010/01/26/2010-farm-system-rankings/

      SI’s quote on the Dodgers?

      “L.A. has spent less on draft picks the last two years than any club, and it shows.”

      I wonder what has happened since then? …. maybe it was dumping some of our best prospects for marginal veterans that helped us to a sub .500 record. Or is it just “depends on where you look”?

      And if you are counting Ely and Link as prospects, ok, but don’t forget they are costing the Dodgers over $10 million.

      The ticket pricing is also interesting, 60% staying the same, 20% going down and 20% going up. Remember, according to his own business plan, McGoo (love that name) is counting on 3.8 million showing up. If he doesn’t “adjust” the roster, that ain’t gonna happen.

      You may be right about Martin. A modest raise would be likely, even though he had a down year, so unless he is willing to sign for less, the best move for the Dodgers is to let him walk. Bummer for everyone. I think he looks forward to a much better year next year.

      “Boy are the rumors are flying about who the Dodgers will trade, sign and non-tender! Officially, 106% of the rumors are wrong.”

      According to you own words, your predictions are wrong. Especially that part about a market for Broxton. Throw the rumor out there and watch the response.

      James Loney is 26, and even after a down year on a down club, he has a career .288 avg., 20+ home run potential and is a Gold Glove talent at first base. There are a number of teams, and batting instructors that would love to get their hands on him. Again, throw his name out there and see what happens.

      No news on the divorce front. Everything depends on what happens there. It could be a very long few months.

  2. Ray says:

    Alot has happened since JAnuary, and this list does not include Zach Lee, who could be the LAD #1 prospect. You can say the same about other teams 2010 draft picks as well, but still….Lee is special.

  3. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    This is later news on Logan White, courtesy of MLB Trade Rumors, which can be found in the box above.

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/10/mets-gm-rumors-white-alderson.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+MlbTradeRumors+%28MLB+Trade+Rumors%29

    If White is being interviewed for a scouting position, then that doesn’t constitute a promotion from his current job. My understanding is that permission to talk to someone under contract is generally granted as a courtesy in cases where the interview could lead to a promotion. So what’s up with this? Would Colletti actually prefer that White take a job somewhere else, thus allowing him to bring in his own guy? Whatever the case, Logan White will likely be gone from the Dodgers sooner or later.

  4. lawdog says:

    Giving Dodger stadium a fresh coat of paint every 40 or 50 years is the type of basic maintenance I’d expect of even the most heinous owner. You have to take that type of basic care of your property whether you want to do that or not.

    Spiffing up the facility in Glendale was necessary to avoid the outcry for his abandoning the Florida traditional spring home of the team. Plus, it helps draw more fans to the meaningless spring training games.

    Both moves were to insure that fans would feel comfortable spending their hard earned loot watching Dodger games. (Hardly the mark of an owner trying to build a winning franchise.)

    McGoo actually made one major draft signing this year–probably as a requirement from Selig’s office to try and stimulate fan interest. Our farm system is in the toilet and has been going deeper down the lue since we gave away Santana for a little pocket change for McGoo’s weekend international junkets aboard his private jet. He refuses to offer arbitration to players who are obviously going to turn it down just so he won’t have to play for multiple first round picks. Too expensive. So our farm system’s cupboard is bare and we have holes all over the lineup.

    Watch and see. If McGoo had any hope of rebuilding the farm anytime soon, he’ll offer arbitration to Lilly and Kuroda and any other player who’ll bring high draft picks if they turn him down and leave. No player in his right mind would now accept a contract that basically pays him 10% now and the rest is spread over the next 30 years ala Manny and Jonsey. Only a fool agrees to work full time for an insolvent owner who wants to leverage most of your salary into the future when he has no real assets with which to secure the “dollar down and chase me around” scenario. Is Selig going to guarantee all the leveraged contracts? If not, McGoo will have no choice but to put together a team on the cheap, and as we all know–”If it’s on the cheap, we won’t compete!”

    McGoo’s idea of rebuilding the club is to bring in some geezers, neverweres and wannabes who’ll play for the league minimum. He’ll count on the lemmings continuing to pay to see .400 baseball just like last year. If he draws 3.5 million fans again, he can maintain his decadent, criminal life style and make the lawyers play his familiar: “Dollar down and chase me around” for the rest of their ill gotten loot.

    No player in their right mind will stay here any longer than they are required to do so under the collective bargaining system. Expect an exodus, not only of martin and Loney, but also Ethier, Kemp, Broxton, Billingsley, Kurshaw and everybody else once they are eligible for free agency. And Dumbo McGoo will be too cheap to offer them arbitration anyway.

    Oh what a tangled web he’s weaved since first McGoo decided to play on the cheap.

    All right Mover. Answer all those points–not just the familiar one where you holler that Wolf and our 2nd baseman in 2009 would have accepted and made our team worse. That one is lame. But you don’t even have a lame argument against the rest of the points..

    • Ray says:

      Lawdog-quite creative spin you have there on teh LAD organization. So Selig demanded that OUR owner, the cheap one, pay Zach Lee $5-6 million dollar bonus to keep the fan base happy.
      Also, regarding the “leveraged” contracts-am I the only one who think LAD is not the only team that gives them out? I am pretty sure the Mets are still paying Bobby Bonilla and he has been retired for about 10 years or so.
      So improving the look of Dodger stadium and building a state of the art minor league facility is not the mark of an owner who wants to build a winning franchise? THEN WHAT IS?
      The farm system looks pretty good right now according to BA, but Lawdog begs to disagree…..why?

      • Badger says:

        Ray… here, you can read up on how teams have structured contracts from 2010 to 2014 right here:

        http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/2005/01/los-angeles-dodgers.html

        yes, teams do used the deferred contract system. Let me know if you see any differences between what the Dodgers are doing and oh, say the Mets.

        as for the Dodgers minor league system being “pretty good right now” – I would say the jury is out on that one. I just checked 4 different top prospect lists and they haven’t changed – we have some good players in the lower leagues, but top prospect? still only 2 in the top 50. Maybe you can post a current site that shows how many of our prospects are rated A and will be ready for the show by 2012. Thanks.

        • Ray says:

          Badger-having two in teh top 50 is pretty good, no? Considering there are 30 teams in MLB. But, the BA list above is current as they are going through the top 20 top prospects in each league in the minors.
          I think we are in good company.
          LAD prospect ready by 2012:
          Sands
          Gordon
          Lee
          Robinson
          De la Rosa
          possibly Webster

          This is my opinin, judging by how close these guys are to the majors. I include Lee based on what MArk heard from his source.

          • Ray says:

            would love to hear Jarred’s opinion on this.

          • Badger says:

            Actually Withrow was dropped out of the top 50 so I could only find 1 and that was Gordon at 39. But I don’t have access to any current information, including what you posted above. So, if you don’t mind, please, could you post the updates that says why this guy Glassey thinks all of a sudden our system is better than what anyone else says?

            Lee? Again, he is a kid that hasn’t pitched an inning in pro ball. Sure, he has some tools, but can we just wait a few months before we give him a spot in our rotation? Strasburg has enormous talent and was rushed up. Same thing with a few other hard throwers like Prior and Wood. How did it work out for those young guys?

            I like Gordon, but don’t believe he is ready. Sands? .270 at AA? Yeah he too has some tools, but he needs to do more. Everything I have read about Robinson has him as a 4th outfielder and I don’t know anything about Webster. De la Rosa only has 51 innings as high as AA.

            Where are the guys who are going to show up in the top 10 next Spring? If you look at the list from January of this year, two of the top 10 guys, Posey and Bumgarner, are now playing and playing well in the play-offs. Where are our guys that are ready to step in now?

          • Jared Massey says:

            What exactly would you like me to address, Ray?

  5. lawdog says:

    Giving Dodger stadium a fresh coat of paint every 40 or 50 years is the type of basic maintenance I’d expect of even the most heinous owner. You have to take that type of basic care of your property whether you want to do that or not.

    Spiffing up the facility in Glendale was necessary to avoid the outcry for his abandoning the Florida traditional spring home of the team. Plus, it helps draw more fans to the meaningless spring training games.

    Both moves were to insure that fans would feel comfortable spending their hard earned loot watching Dodger games. (Hardly the mark of an owner trying to build a winning franchise.)

    McGoo actually made one major draft signing this year–probably as a requirement from Selig’s office to try and stimulate fan interest. Our farm system is in the toilet and has been going deeper down the lue since we gave away Santana for a little pocket change for McGoo’s weekend international junkets aboard his private jet. He refuses to offer arbitration to players who are obviously going to turn it down just so he won’t have to play for multiple first round picks. Too expensive. So our farm system’s cupboard is bare and we have holes all over the lineup.

    Watch and see. If McGoo had any hope of rebuilding the farm anytime soon, he’ll offer arbitration to Lilly and Kuroda and any other player who’ll bring high draft picks if they turn him down and leave. No player in his right mind would now accept a contract that basically pays him 10% now and the rest is spread over the next 30 years ala Manny and Jonsey. Only a fool agrees to work full time for an insolvent owner who wants to leverage most of your salary into the future when he has no real assets with which to secure the “dollar down and chase me around” scenario. Is Selig going to guarantee all the leveraged contracts? If not, McGoo will have no choice but to put together a team on the cheap, and as we all know–”If it’s on the cheap, we won’t compete!”

    McGoo’s idea of rebuilding the club is to bring in some geezers, neverweres and wannabes who’ll play for the league minimum. He’ll count on the lemmings continuing to pay to see .400 baseball just like last year. If he draws 3.5 million fans again, he can maintain his decadent, criminal life style and make the lawyers play his familiar: “Dollar down and chase me around” for the rest of their ill gotten loot.

    No player in their right mind will stay here any longer than they are required to do so under the collective bargaining system. Expect an exodus, not only of martin and Loney, but also Ethier, Kemp, Broxton, Billingsley, Kurshaw and everybody else once they are eligible for free agency. And Dumbo McGoo will be too cheap to offer them arbitration anyway.

    Oh what a tangled web he’s weaved since first McGoo decided to play on the cheap.

    All right Mover. Answer all those points–not just the familiar one where you holler that Wolf and our 2nd baseman in 2009 would have accepted and made our team worse. That one is lame. But you don’t even have a lame argument against the rest of the points..

  6. lawdog says:

    All of our top prospects on the farm have been traded for geezers and wannabes. Haven’t you been paying attention? It doesn’t matter what others say, we’ve given up future stars to keep the price down on geezers we’ve aquird at the trade deadline.

    I’m not positive Selig told McGoo to sign our top pick this year, but I can sense the signing went against every fiber of his rotten being. Someone must have told him to throw the fans a bone if he didn’t want the franchise to tank even worse than it has.

    Painting a stadium, which is almost 50 years old now and far from state of the art is something I’d expect an owner to do as part of “maintaining” the structure. It’s hardly an innovation.

    And making a new spring training facility look good to justify the high price of the tickets he’s going to charge for meaningless games down there when the fans were already made as hell for the abandoning of the Florida facility which had so much history attached to it as well as a fan base that would be deprived of a way to watch the team in the spring without flying all the way to Arizona–it was hardly a nice thing to do but instead a necessity to keep the cash cow pumping out milk for him.

    That covers the few points you tried to refute Ray. Care to try again on the rest of them, or perhaps rehabilitate the loseing points you tried to make? :roll:

    • Ray says:

      the Dodgers fans were so mad for LAD abandoning Florida that they stopped going tO ST games in Arizona….NOT.
      Other than Santana, please name the TOP prospect LAD has traded away….that were so good they should be on the current squad? Laroche=bust, Guzman-bust, Tiffany-bust, McDonald-will be a bust, Dewitt-we’ll see if he still has a job in two years. HAve YOU been paying attention since they were traded?
      McCOURT did more than paint the stadium…obviously more spin for negative Lawdog. spin it the way you want.
      Moving spring training to Arizona makes sense!!! Business sense because it is closer to where the Dodgers play their home games, and gives guys who are recovering from injury a place to workout. It makes sense for teh players as well….closer to their homes.
      Who are the future stars we gave up?
      You need to rahab your thought process before you write.

  7. Ray says:

    Dodgers Assistant General Manager Logan White will interview for the New York Mets’ vacant general manager’s post, according to a baseball source who spoke on the condition of anonymity.

    White will be back with the Dodgers next season in his present role if he isn’t hired by the Mets. With his current two-year contract set to expire this year, White has reached an agreement with the Dodgers on terms of a new deal.

  8. lawdog says:

    Sorry to be so contentious here. I don’t like rocking the boat my friends are on, but I don’t like being called an asshole repeatedly for refusing to buy Mark’s “Pollyanna” assessment of the state of the Dodgers when I know it’s just the company line bullshit postion.

    I’m no homer and will always call them as i see them. I’m sorry if that ruffles some feathers, but it’s better not to dwell in fantasyland when it comes to something that commands as much of your time as following the Dogs does.

    If I’m wrong on something show me where and why. Don’t just use ridicule and move on.

    • Ray says:

      Lawdog-I only responded in the tone that you responded previously. let me remind you:
      “That covers the few points you tried to refute Ray. Care to try again on the rest of them, or perhaps rehabilitate the loseing points you tried to make?”

      How should I have taken that? “rehabilitate the losing point I tried to make”??

      You say we traded away all these top prospects….who are they?

      Following teh Dogs???

  9. lawdog says:

    I’ve felt testy about this since Mover called me an asshole for my feelings about the McGoos. I didn’t mean to use that tone on you Ray. Sorry about that.

    Santana was th worst eample. MacDonald is a close second. Those are the ones that stick in my mind. We also let a 3rd baseman slip away for nothing who was considered a “can’t miss” prospect but with the Pirates he failed to really impress when he finalyy was given nhis shot. Also gave away a highly regarded 2nd baseman who’s name escapes me. He went to Arizona for nothing. Stultz was given away. Those are just the ones that come to mind right now without giving it much thought. No one would dispute that we have nothing down on the farm right now that isn’t 2+ years away from having a shot at the bigs.

    • Ely's Coming, Better Hide Your Haeger says:

      I think everyone’s issue with McDonald wasn’t that he was traded… it was who he was traded for. Octavio Dotel.

      That trade was worse than the Carlos Santana trade.

      You may not like Casey Blake…. but he contributed to the Dodgers the past two years. He isn’t the greatest 3rd baseman by a longshot…. but he helped.

      Dotel was here for three weeks and was awful and was eventually traded away to the Rockies

    • I missed one-Josh Bell for George Sherrill. That deal doesn’t look good now after the season Sherrill had, but Bell didn;t do much in his first crack in Baltimore-small sample though.
      I am not a fan of McDonald….he is inconsistent as they come.
      Laroche was the can’t miss prospect that went to Pittsburgh, but without that deal, LAD would never have experienced Mannywood’s amazing two months in LA IN 2008 and their first playoff series win in 20 years. And now Laroche is a bust…sad to say….I was high on him….even traded a very cheap Brandon Phillips for him in a keeper fantasy league….neither here nor there….but I liked him alot,
      Tony Abreu will be nothing more than a bench guy in the majors, so we didn’t lose much there.
      I disagree….I think we have alot on the farm in Gordon, Sands, Lee, Robinson, Miller, Withrow, Martin, RDLR…..some are a year away-Gordon and Sands, maybe RDLR…..others need more time.

      • Badger says:

        For the record, Tony Abreu and Andy LaRoche were a much better minor league hitters than any of the names you mention here. Just sayin’….. you never know for sure until they get to the Bigs.

  10. lawdog says:

    The move to Arizona made west coast fans happy, but it royally pissed off all the Dodger fans on the East Coast (many of whom had been rabid fans since the days of the Brooklyn Dodgers.) I simply pointed out that McGoo had to really gussy up the Glendale facility to make up for abandoning Dodger Town and to have an excuse to charge Arizona folks an arm and a leg to watch meaningless games.

    I guess one could say he’s also charging fans in LA an arm and a leg to watch meaningless games. :roll:

  11. lawdog says:

    It’s your serve Ray! :mrgreen:

  12. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    It’s got nothing to do with whether or not the prospects the Dodgers traded turn out to be solid big leaguers. It’s what we should have gotten in return that matters. LaRoche along with some others got us Manny. Clearly that worked for us in 2008. No one could have predicted that Manny would be suspended for the use of PED’s, so by and large that was a good deal in the short term, that turned sour through no fault of management.

    Santana for Blake was simply downright stupid, and no matter what anyone says, I’m convinced Santana was included to save $2 million, an amount, as I’ve pointed out in the past, is less than some unproven amateur prospects receive as bonuses. Sending McDonald and Lambo to the Pirates for Dotel was insanity. I thought so at the time, and I haven’t changed my mind. It doesn’t matter how McDonald and Lambo fare in the future, but it does matter that both of them together or included in a larger package could have landed a lot better than Dotel. The Dodgers simply handed away chips they may have been able to use a lot more productively in the future. DUMB, DUMB, AND DUMBER. Trading DeWitt and the minor leaguers that went with him for Lilly and Theriot probably made some sense. I’m no Lilly lover, but he did pitch well for the most part, and would have improved the team’s chance to contend if the offense, along with the bullpen hadn’t completely tanked.

    There is no doubt that the Dodgers have not spent much money in the last few years to replenish the farm system. That being said, there are still a sizable number of prospects that may make an impact over the next several years. How much of an impact in 2011 is still up in the air.

    Certainly, Kenley Jansen is one of our impact youngsters. And the fact that he’s already spent some time with the Dodgers doesn’t diminish his worth, but it does diminish the Dodger farm system in the eyes of those that rate our prospects, since he’s no longer considered a prospect, though he is in reality tantamount to a prospect. Other solid prospects that come to mind are Dee Gordon, Jerry Sands, Trayvon Robinson, Rubby De La Rosa, Allen Webster, Zach Lee and Aaron Miller. I still consider Ethan Martin and Chris Withrow to be good prospects, since it’s not unusual for youngsters their age to struggle early on. And in Martin’s case, we really don’t know the extent of the knee injury he had after signing. It likely was a factor in setting him back. And there were guys in the lower minors this year that showed promise, such as Lemmerman, Akins, Landry, Cavazos-Galvez, etc. Sure, some of them will likely disappoint, but there could be surprises also. And there’s always the young player in the Domincan Summer League that we con’t know anything about. I believe RDLR was one of those.

    The strength of the Dodger farm system in 2010 was below the AAA level. But that’s not totally unexpected, given that the upper levels of the system lost players due to the promotions over the last several years of Kemp, Loney, Billingsley, Kershaw, etc.

    As currently constituted the Dodgers have a strong base from which to contend in 2011, and enough young players to allow the farm system to continue to re-stock itself over the next several years. If McCourt surprises us and spends some significant money this winter, the Dodgers could get healthy very fast. If the Dodgers decide to play it cheap, then they are in trouble, because whatever talent we do have in the minors will likely not be ready until 2012 and beyond.

    • Well done Brooklyn Dodger.
      I am pretty sure Jansen is still considered a rookie since he only pitched 40+ innings this year. Jared can correct me if I am wrong here.
      Sands and Gordon will be in AAA in 2011, I think. Maybe RDLR also. Miller could be there by the end of the year, as could Withrow if he can get things going again.

  13. Mark Timmons says:

    Lawdog,

    Where did I call you an A-Hole? Chapter and Verse!

    OK,

    You said: “Spiffing up the facility in Glendale was necessary to avoid the outcry for his abandoning the Florida traditional spring home of the team. Plus, it helps draw more fans to the meaningless spring training games.”

    That is not true. Most of the money spent at Camelback is not seen by the fans. It is seen by the players and minor leaguers – it is player development stuff. The Dodgers share the same game facilities as the the ChiSox. So, your reasoning is flawed, that McCourt did it for the fans. Not true. He did it for player development.

    Next, you said:

    Both moves were to insure that fans would feel comfortable spending their hard earned loot watching Dodger games. (Hardly the mark of an owner trying to build a winning franchise.)”

    Totally wrong again. It had nothing to do with the fans. It was totally for player development.

    I could go on and on to correct your mis-statements, but it’s not worth the time to me. It’s just that you take everything McCourt does and spin it so that you can make him look bad. You can do that, but it doesn’t make it true.

  14. Mark Timmons says:

    … and if there were East Coast fans they didn’t show up. I went to Vero for years and some games there were 2,000 fans or less. They only showed up the last year there.

  15. Mark Timmons says:

    Brooklyn,

    Insofar as all of the prospects the Dodgers have traded: Abreu, Santana, McDonald, Bell, Lambo, et al – the jury is still out!

    Santana had a good start, but so far you can’t say that any of them will be even an average major league player. When Jansen had an amazing (not just good) start, you said to wait and see. I feel the same way about Santana.

    Personally, I don’t think Bell or Abreu will be anything, but I did think that LaRoche would be good, so what do I know? I did really like Lambo at one time, but then decided he was a “knucklehead.”

    Time will tell.

    Logan White told me that Santana was the deal-breaker in the Blake trade and I believe him. You don’t have to, but I know him and you don’t, so I understand why you might be skeptical.

  16. Mark Timmons says:

    On Sands:

    There are a few people in the organization who think he can play 3B – I think it’s more out of need than what he exhibits skill-wise, but it could be a good call because he has a good glove but not great lateral movement (in my opinion). It would be great if he could master that position.

  17. Long Live Vin says:

    Wow…guess I’ve been away for a while…I missed the banter…my wife told me to get a life! Anyway, for my once a month post….Loney? Please get rid of him…good glove, but I was sick of his constant whiffs…he will never hit for power, NOR will he be Keith Hernandez…Russell Martin? I don’t really care, he hasn’t done much lately, and I don’t care about 2-3 years ago. Broxton? I think he took 5 years off of my life this year(He is the current Tom Neidenfuer for me)…I feel sorry for him…but I will pack his bags personally? Dunn? Sure, why not. Beltre? The only memory of him for me is the constant waving at sliders low and away (maybe he and Kemp could compare videos of each other)…I don’t know much of what the Dodgers have in the minors…so, I can’t chime in….Trades? We’ve gave the Pirates good players over the years (not counting La Roche),… remember RJ Reynolds and Sid Bream for Bill Madlock? So, seeing McDonald thrive, hurts a bit. Still, I’m rooting for Scott Gordon to hit a grand slam for me, but I’m not holding my breath. Like I said, if McCourt regains control, then fine, BUT he’d BETTER bring some investors (ie. real money) with him. All I want: to have a superstar, to beat the Giants, the Phillies (with Pitchers who pitch inside to Victorino), players who get upset when they lose (and can fight), and to win, win, win. That’s all I want.

    BTW: I’m NOT watching the Giants and the Phillies (that’s Chinese Water Torture for me), so keep me informed.

  18. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    Mark,

    You said “Insofar as all of the prospects the Dodgers have traded: Abreu, Santana, McDonald, Bell, et al–the jury is still out.”

    I absolutely agree that the jury is still out, which, by the way has nothing to do with what I said. Fact is, I never mentioned the Bell for Sherrill deal, primarily because I always suspected that Bell was overhyped, and I had no problems with that deal. I also didn’t mention the Abreu deal, because although I wasn’t thrilled with it, the Dodgers had other options at the time at 2B, and were in need of pitching. But yes, I did like Abreu, and still think he could turn out to ba a productive big leaguer. Time will tell on that one.

    But you appear to have missed my major point, which was that no matter how these players perform going forward, the Dodgers traded away chips that could have (at the time or in the future) potentially been packaged for more than Dotel or Blake. Wouldn’t it be nice to have some of those chips now going into the winter to use as trade bait, or for ourselves. In my view, Colletti put too much on the table too early.

    And I didn’t exactly say “wait and see” with respect to Jansen, although I guess you could interpret it that way. I’m sure I’ve suggested that things could change the more he gets around the league. But for the most part I believe he could make the necessary adjustments (hopefully in relatively short order). However, I’ve also said that I believe he is closer material, but that I would prefer that he’s not rushed into that role prematurely, especially given that he’s been pitching for less than two years, and that I prefer to err on the side of caution. I’ve also said that although I believe that Broxton can bounce back, I would still trade him if the right deal came along (probably netting more than you would require), and hand over the closing role to a combination of Kuo and Jansen. Unlike you, I prefer to ease Jansen into that role rather than over-burden him at this still very early stage in his development. In other words, I prefer not to force feed him. Even Mariano Rivera started out as a setup guy.

    My preference is to maintain Broxton as the closer, with Jansen taking on the 8th inning role. Kuo could then be used as needed in the 7th, 8th, or 9th innings. His use in the 8th or 9th would essentially keep both Broxton and Jansen from being overworked, and would on occasion create more favorable matchups in the late innings.

    I know some people de-value the closer’s role. I don’t. In fact, my ideal is a 7-man deep bullpen (not always possible) that shuts down teams from the middle innings on. Just as the Dodgers invariably fail to tack on runs in games, I think it is essential to keep the opponent from tacking on runs of their own. And the deeper the bullpen, the less stress placed on its members as the season drags on. Pitching, pitching, pitching is not only about starters, it’s also about relentlessly keeping opposing teams off the scoreboard.

    Here are Carlos Santana’s stats from Baseball-Reference.com.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/santaca01.shtml

    I know that he got off to a good start and then tailed off some. But I also know that that isn’t unusual for a rookie, and I also know that he was injured, is only 24 years of age, and ended up with a .401 OBP, which is the norm for his career up to this point. He’s hit throughout his career, and has always had a superior eye at the plate, as evidenced by his consitently high OBP, year after year.

    So you know Logan White. Maybe you’re bosom buddies, or maybe you’ve spoken to him just a few times. Whatever the case, even you should know that sometimes you know people for years and still don’t know them. But I guess you can look him in the eye and know all there is to know. Or could it be that to Logan White you’re just another outsider, and that he has no intention of revealing to you anything that might stir up trouble for the people he works for? So when he tells you that Santana “was the deal-breaker in the Blake trade”, might it simply be that he was spinning the Dodger line to you? In fact, why would he do anything else? Like I said about Colletti in an earlier post, if Logan is anything, stupid is not one of them. I seriously doubt that if money was the issue he would have revealed that to you, if only because it’s what was required of him given his obligations as an employee of the Dodgers. Doing anything else would have not only jeopardized his position with the Dodgers, but would have also damaged his credibility throughout the industry.

    So yes, I’m “skeptical”, and for good reason.

    Besides, what makes you think that the Indians weren’t desirous of dumping Blake’s salary, and only agreed to pay the remaining $2 million when they realized that they could get a top professional prospect for less than what they would pay for a top amateur prospect? I seriously doubt that not including Santana would have been a “deal-breaker”. I think the Indians wanted to deal Blake, if only to save money, and finally decided to spend some cash to obtain a top catching prospect.

    Finally, I would love for you to explain why the Dodgers won’t sign Jayson Werth because he’s represented by Boras, but would sign Beltre who’s represented by the same agent. In the “Frankly you will be Surprised” thread I wrote: “So you think that the Dodgers can sign Beltre, a Boras client, but not Werth, because he’s represented by Boras. Did Beltre dump Boras and I don’t know about it?”

  19. mark says:

    Brooklyn,

    The main reason is that Beltre wants to be in LA. Werth doesn’t, although if he got the right deal he would go. LA is still home to Adrian. In reality, I can’t preduct we will get either one.

  20. Badger says:

    As articulate and to the point as Brooklyn is above, and he was both, he is just repeating what has been said in here over and over again for weeks. Brookln my friend, we are talking to the wind.

    Fact of the matter is, until we know how many tail feathers Frankie McPigeon has left after this divorce we won’t know what it is the Dodgers can do. If this thing drags out, there will be no Boras client coming to L.A. period. Colletti is going to be challenged to balance the books and the players like never before. You know what he needs? I’ll tell you what he needs, and it ain’t Adrian Beltre it’s Adrian Gonzalez he needs 8 of them. Gonzalez is paid less than Casey Freakin’ Blake and pounds 30 homers and 100 rbi’s every year. Go get a lineup of those guys Ned, cuz that is what your budget is next year.

    Roll your sleeves up, sharpen that pencil (and he has to use a pencil cuz there will be a lot of erasing going on) and figure on cauliflower ear cuz you are going to be on the phone 24/7 all winter. He needs to find the deals out there, trade this guy for those guys and those guys for that guy and get some real baseball players in here that are ON THEIR WAY UP! We have brought in overpaid geezers for too long now. As long as Frankie McPenurious owns this team we will be looking at more of you ain’t seen nothin’ yet when it comes to inability to pay for the right guy at the right time.

    Out of necessity other teams have learned how to do it. If we must, go get one of those moneyball GM’s to get in here and get it done for less.

  21. lawdog says:

    Great posts Brooklyn! You, Badger, Roger and I are on the same page. ;)

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