Categorized | Mark Timmons

McCourt seemed like he was finally getting it…..

McCourt seemed like he was finally getting it…..

After changing his GM horse, and his approach to owning a Major League baseball team, it seemed that Frank McCourt was finally getting to a point that he understood what it takes to consistently put a competitive team on the field. His first choice of GM, Paul DePodesta, suggested that it was a moneyball approach in which he believed. OK, I can live with that. But then after less than two years with this strategy, he dumped the plan and went with a Sabean approach – old vets with a history of success.  At least during this period of self discovery, Frank did not go “all in” by selling the farm. We have our own on the field, and a few left in the stable. McCourt came into this somewhat underfunded, and now with his personal life in shambles, we don’t know if he will land on both feet, and if those feet will even have shoes on them after Jamie and her lawyers are done.

As for where we stand as of this moment and to continue yesterdays thread:

I don’t put Pierre in the same category as Schmidt and Jones. Pierre was a guy who came to play everyday and without him last year, do the Dodgers get to the finish line in first place? I think not.

But H I agree with the general premise of your post. We are treading water and the reason we are is because of the mess in which our owner finds himself. I don’t think any of us are whining about it, we are just frustrated that the owner of the Los Angeles Dodgers, one of the most storied and valuable franchises in Major League Baseball, is in this precarious position.

And I have a fundamental disagreement with the idea that having money to spend, and spending it, doesn’t guarantee success.  Sure, it doesn’t guarantee a championship, but take a look at the teams that have a lot of money and compare their success to the franchises that don’t. Every now and then a team like Tampa sneaks into the fun zone of the play-offs, but the teams that always have a chance or the ones with the high payrolls. This coming year who you gonna bet on? – the Yankees, Red Sox and the Mets, or the Nationals, Pirates and Padres.

The Dodgers should be in the running every year, and frankly they have been for a couple of years now. I think if we are honest with ourselves, we knew we didn’t have the best team in the NL last year. We had a shot, and that is all fans ask for, but the Phillies are better and deserved to be there the last two years. To tell the truth, I wasn’t so confident in the series against the Cards. They had better starting pitching than we did.

Again, I am just frustrated that our owner is handcuffed. We won’t know much about the end game of this situation until June. We watch as other franchises spend the money and make the trades that improve their chances while two of our best players walk without offers or compensation for their leaving. Maddening.

About Rory

I have been a Dodger fan since 1959 when my grandpa took me to my first game at the Coliseum. I even went to a World Series game that year, sat in front of Joe DiMaggio and behind Nat King Cole. As a young boy in Canoga Park I can remember falling asleep every night, with the window open and crickets in background, listening to Vin Scully and Jerry Doggett on my turquoise Admiral radio. To this day whenever I hear Vinnie's voice I am taken back to that time. I was a decent enough player in high school, a shortstop, to be offered a try out with the Dodgers. It was a hot late Spring day in Fullerton and I played very well. I was pulled aside by a scout who informed me the Dodgers wanted me as a second baseman. Problem was, I had already committed to the Marine Corps. I survived my tour in Vietnam and came back to start my adult civilian life with no idea what I was destined to do. I have changed careers many times over the years and I often wonder how my life would have been different had I taken that second base job back in 1966. I love baseball and played it in the MABL in Northern California until I was 56 years old. I am now 61 and my playing days are sadly over. But, I will be a Dodger fan forever. I bleed blue, and I will support my team until my time here is done.

51 Responses to “McCourt seemed like he was finally getting it…..”

  1. Ken says:

    The Dodgers should try to run their operations more like the Twins with their paltry salary, great player development, and lesser number of Special Assistants to the GM.

  2. Harold says:

    Mark I wasn’t lumping JP with Schmidt and Jones for the same reason. It was because we are now paying a large part of JP’s salary to play somewhere else until 2012. I was,in fact, a big supporter of JP and still don’t feel we treated him very well. That is, he signed to be an everyday player, and I expect was given that understanding. Yet he soon becams a bench player. I am pleased for JP that he has a spot to play and pleased for us that we don’t have a log jam in our OF.

    I do agree that tons of money enhances the chances of success, but does not guarantee it. I feel, however, it is how we spend the money that counts more. $100M spent wisely should allow a team to be competitive with an occasional blip over that to acquire a missing piece. By the way, I am not putting my money on the Mets. Certainly us before them.


  3. Rory says:

    You are right H. Having money is one thing, being smart with it is another. We have done some things right, but I can’t think of what they are at this moment because the shadow being cast by the bonehead moves – and those include the extended contracts you mention.

    We are at what I find an interesting crossroads right now. We have enough of our own still yet affordable young talent to be competitive on the field, and what we need is some speed at the top of the order (replacement for Hudson) and two strong starters capable of eating innings and getting us to our bullpen with a chance to win. And because of circumstance, the checkbook has a hold on it. Last year, what was needed was that post season starter that could shut down the opposition twice in a series. That starter was Cliff Lee and we saw where he ended up. The Phillies are NL franchise du juor. They are a complete team. Will they sustain it? Eh, who knows, but you have to admire what they have done the last two years. They smoked us, and last year they did it by being able to do what we could not – get the pitcher.

    This year I see other teams ready to make a move. I think the Mets are back, the Cardinals and Cubs will be competitive as will the Brewers, the Braves, the Dbacks, the Giants and the Rockies. I just don’t see it as our year. Not yet anyway. I wait and hope to be convinced otherwise.

  4. lawdog says:

    Letsee… If the Dogs are about to get apparaised in order to fix a value based upon which he will have to pay the Meamie, he’d better go sign Sheets and Padilla pronto to front loaded deals as well!

    Spin, spin, spin. This ain’t politics or and perfectly ain’t a show business character. He’s more like a Trump-wannabe.

    All I want is the truth! No more spin! Just give me some truth!

    No short haired friend of tricky-dickey’s gonna sell me with just a pocket full of soap! It’s money for rope! Money for dope!


  5. Mark Timmons says:

    I think the Mets and Cubs will be a train-wreck with their managers and GM’s gone by August.

    The Cards are the real deal. Watch Dave Duncan turn Brad Penny into Cy Young.

    The D-Backs are better, but not good.

    The Brewers are better, but not good.

    The Giants may be better, but their defense will kill their pitching.

    The Braves could surprise.

    The Rockies peaked. They will head down.

    The Phillies could head South, even with Halladay.

  6. Rory says:

    The Mets won 70 games last year. They WILL be better than that.

    The Dbacks and Giants will be better too. We won 95 last year. We won’t do that again, and some of those losses will be against the division.

    The Rockies have Tracy from the beginning and have a team of horses. I like their chances. I think they are again capable of 90 wins.

    The Phillies will be just as good.

    Cubs? Who knows. They are supposed to be good every year.

    Brewers got better.

    Agree about the Cardinals.

    Agree about the Braves.

  7. steevo17 says:

    This just in: R. Martin, J. Loney, G. Sherrill and H. Kuo all signed to 1-year contracts. Loney will be making 3.1 mil, Sherrill 4.5 and Kuo will get 950k…all pretty decent raises. Martins terms weren’t given, should be a couple of mil at least.

    I think the Dodgers are on the right track here, hopefully now J. Broxton and A. Ethier (both still waiting in arbitration) can be signed long-term (3 years would be nice) for Kemp-style money…both are deserving.

  8. Ken says:

    Now everyone is signed and the payroll is about 93 mil. Just high enough to prevent the Dodgers from signing more than one starting pitcher plus maybe Weaver.

  9. DRomo says:

    93 million? I think that frees us up for a pitcher now (i.e. Sheets or Bedard?) I have said it before and I’ll say it again. This team has money concerns, OK but they are not dead. They needed a budget. With all the arbitration cases pending they could not set that budget. Now that it is set the Dodgers will sign a pitcher & or position players. Mark my words.

  10. Rory says:

    OK, 93 mil. I was under the impression that the Dodgers could support 100 mil without much pressure. It still looks to me like the team will try to hold serve until the deadline, then make a move – one way or the other depending how the first half goes.

    If it comes down to it, I hope we sign a good pitcher with whatever we have left and go ahead and roll the dice with DeWitt and Carroll. If Martin returns to form, and Blake is healthy, we can hide one bad hitter if the pitching holds up. The up the middle defense is weakened, but, so be it. This team needs to get back to what it does well – pitching.

  11. Ken says:

    The Dodgers can thank Dave Stewart for being a reasonable negotiator on behalf of his players, which helped set the tone for generally reasonable salaries being negotiated with the rest of the Dodger arbitration eligible players. However, with Sherrill’s new contract he may be difficult to trade without throwing in a minor leaguer. Maybe the Dodgers will keep Sherrill and sign a couple of pitchers and maybe an eyechart!

  12. lawdog says:

    The Rockies have Dick Tracy again as their manager? I remember Tracy well. He’ll cost them at least 10 games with his screwball decisions on the fly during games and keep them from the playoffs. We got lucky on that one.

  13. steevo17 says:

    Whoa…ESPN is reporting Martin’s gonna get 5.05 mil, some kinda bump for cash-strapped team! Also they’re reporting both Broxton and Ethier signed 2-year contracts.

    Looks like Ned is making his moves now. Maybe there could be a significant F/A pitcher signing in the near future? Now that the core has been secured, I think that should be next.

    Rumors are the Dodgers are interested in Ben Sheets…if he’s healthy, who knows? I’m still of the opinion that the Dodgers should give both McDonald and Elbert a serious shot at making the rotation.
    The bullpen is stocked and the only questions remaining are the #4 and #5 starters

    I have to say that I seem to have more confidence in DeWitt than anyone here. I think he will be a mainstay for the next several years in our infield…3rd base eventually being his permanent home.

    My mantra for 2010 is and will be “Give the kids a chance”…we could do worse.

  14. Roger Dodger says:

    Steeve — I somewhat agree with you that the Dodgers need 2 more starters. But I differ in the placement number. I think the Dodgers, if they really want a shot to be a solid team — do not need a new #4 and #5 starters — but new #1 and #2 starters.

    I have been saying for almost a year now, Billingsley and Kershaw are not right now #1 and #2 (or switch the numbers) starters. Not matching up against other solid teams #1 and #2 starters.

    But move them to #3 and #4 starters — and they will be more effective and win more games.

  15. Ken says:

    Sheets throws 92 today – Dodgers in top 5 candidates.

  16. Mark Timmons says:

    It would be great to have a #1, but those guys cost you 8 years/$160 mil and their arms fall off. We could have had Halladay… for Withrow, Billingsley and Kemp – that’s what they wanted.

    Our big hope is that 2010 is the year Kershaw and Bills become #1 and 32.

    I think the Dodgers will give Sheets an incentive-laden deal where he can make $10 mil a year, but they won’t guarantee it.

  17. lawdog says:

    Padilla was the best pitcher the Dogs had besides Wolf at th end of the year. And Sheets was one of the best pitchers in the game of baseball before foregoing last season due to the sore harm ..Signing Padilla to a cheap incentive lasden contracxt is a no brainer. He can bring it! And his off speed stuff is good as well. Sheet, if Ben Sheets, is healed, he’s as good as anyone out there.

    Someone remind Perfectly that if he spends money now on these guys we not only contend, but it inflates the overhead and therefore lowers the amount he’ll have to pay his dragonlady. It’s a no-brainer.

    What he’s doing now reminds me of that old baseball move: “Major League. Anybody else remember that classic? Little did I think that the owner portrayed there would one day resemble the Dog’s own Screaming Meamie.

    Maybe they want to relocate the Dodgers to the Cayman Islands?

  18. Rory says:

    “We could have had Halladay… for Withrow, Billingsley and Kemp – that’s what they wanted.”

    They wanted an All Star starting pitcher, a Gold Glove Silver Slugger Award winner AND a top pitching prospect…….

    and yet they settled for three guys named Drabek, Taylor and DeArnaud – none of whom have done a thing at the ML level.

    Let’s be honest here, we didn’t get Halladay because of the $20 million a year the Phillies were willing to pay him.

    I am still in waiting mode. Show me the moves and I am willing to admit I was wrong.

  19. Brooklyn Dodger says:

    For me the key to the Dodgers success in 2010 is the continued development and maturity of our young veterans. If that happens, it’s tantamount to adding free agent talent.

    Certainly nothing is written in stone, but it’s not inconceivable that we will see significant power increases from Loney, Kemp, Martin, and maybe even Ethier. And it’s well within the realm of possibility that Manny bounces back. Beset in large degree by injuries, Billingsley had a horrible second half in 2009. He’s a good bet to return to his first half form. And let’s not forget, that after an 0-4 start in 2008, he finished out the year at 16-6. And was Mark’s failure to shift on the 3 above (“32″ instead of “#2″) a harbinger of things to come (32 = Koufax)?

    DeWitt has shown in the past that he is a patient hitter, with a nice swing and surprising power. And from what I saw of him in the second half of last year, I’m not so sure that Hudson could be counted on to repeat his 2009 performance. If the players around him improve, I’m confident in DeWitt’s ability to give us solid production from 2B. At the very least, I believe he will be at least adequate at 2B, and should improve as the season progresses. And Jamey Carroll will probably be an improvement over what we got from Loretta last year.

    With today’s signings the Dodgers have acheived cost certainty, and will likely acquire a free agent pitcher or two between now and the end of February. From my perspective, there’s a lot to look forward to going into the season.

  20. Roger Dodger says:

    I heard some of the Brewers’ pitching coach while driving in the car today. Wow, he has his act together.

    He talked about pitching and hitting in the bottom of the strike zone and below. Averages, etc. Makes sense.

    That is, which pitcher can throw there, and when they do, what are the results.

    But as fans, when you sit in the outfield seats, you cannot tell just which pitches are in that zone (all the time).

  21. Roger Dodger says:

    Really great to see all of these Dodgers signing contracts with nice money.

    It means we have what we have, for awhile, as the team continues to develop. Most of them like each other. Know each other. And I believe, trust each other.

    Now — fill out the roster.

  22. mark says:


    Halladay didn’t want to play on the West Coast and Drabeck and Taylor will be Billingsley and Kemp in a year or two, but I also think it’s felony stupid to give Halladay $20 mil a year until he’s 38. I’m sure the Dodgers think that too.

    I think the Phillies would have been better with Lee, but the deal-maker was the fact that Halladay wanted to play on the East Coast and was agreeable to sign.

  23. mark says:

    Just read that the D-Backs pulled out of the Sheets-stakes. Their current $79 mil payroll is more than they can afford.

  24. mark says:

    Paul LoDuca is allegedly ready to sign with the Rockies.

  25. A Shot of Haeger says:

    That’s true Halladay had a full no trade clause.. he would never have approved of a trade here.

    Another person who intrigues me is Mark Mulder… I’d want the Dodgers to see how he throws when he’s ready… but he seems like he could be ripe for renewal.

    I have real interest in Ben Sheets… but in order to get him we’ll have to overpay. There were at least 10 teams watching him pitch today.

    I think we need to sign just one pitcher.. preferrably Sheets. then Haeger can win 16 games out of the 5th spot and if Sheets gets hurt, we can give Elbert or McDonald a try

  26. All the Dodgers really need is Manny to have a slightly better than average season, and be there the whole season this time. If Manny shows up the rest of the offense gets that much better. And with our outstanding, and VERY deep, bullpen we won’t need to rely on the starters as much.

    What the hell happened to the pitchers that would win 20 games a season and 18 of the them were complete games?! Fernando, Hershiser, those were men!

  27. lawdog says:

    You’re right to a point Miguel. We can get into the playoffs without a #1 or #2 starter if we have five #3s, a great pen and great position players who can hit, drive in runs and play Defense. But without an ace or a legit #2 we will just be bridesmaids, yet again, come October.

  28. lawdog, we did it in ’88 with MUCH less!

    This just in, Sheets threw well today for scouts, including the Dodgers.

  29. Rory says:

    Kevin Brown didn’t want to play on the West Coast. But, we gave him $105 million and a private jet to fly home between starts and he was happy.

    Halladay went to the NLSC Champions because of the money. But I agree with Mark that his contract is too risky. Especially for a team coming off Schmidt and Jones.

    Drabek will not win 16 games and make the All Star team in two years. Taylor will not win both the Gold Gloves and the Silver Slugger award in a year or two. They are prospects and that is all they are.

    Sheets throws well. I wonder who will outpay us for him? Mets? Cardinals? Cubs?

    I just don’t see us taking the chance. He looks like Jason Schmidt all over again.

  30. DRomo says:

    Drabek will be Billingsley in 2 years? How long will it take a kid to learn to wilt in 5 innings after 100 pitches or when the going gets tough? He had better step up his game if he wants to be on Chad’s level. Lacking testicular fortitude is not something anyone can do, Mr. Drabek!

  31. Ken says:

    Appearantly Ned was able to defer $3 mil of Pierre’s 2010 salary to 2012 before trading him so the current budget is $91 mil. Will Franks go cheap and pay Kershaw the league minimum or will the Dodgers do the right thing and pay him as if they want him to stay past his arbitration years. In my opinion any salary less than $600,000 is s slap in the face.

  32. lawdog says:

    Ahhh, Miguel. The year my fantasies all came true. I remember hiking the Devil’s Slide trial in the San Jacinto Mountains in the Spring of 88 with my family. A stranger on his way down saw my Dodger cap and asked me how I thought we’d do that year. I’d followed the them closely all spring, looked him in the eye and said: “I know we don’t look much better on paper than last season when we finished dead last, but I’ve got a gut feeling we’ll meet the A’s in the series and beat them for the championship. He laughed at me. I wanted to stop in Nevada on the way home and put $100 on that pairing and that result, I was that sure in my gut of guts. My wife put the kybosh on it. I don’t know ow much I would have won.

    But keep in mind we weren’t much better than a last place team on paper that year.

    I had the same kind of intuitive flash about the 1999 Rams who were 476-1 in Nevada the day before their last preseason game. Ruth gave me her official okey dokey to go put #100 on the Rams to win the SuperBowl. I was planning to leave monday to go place the bet when the Rams lost their starting qb, Trent Green, to a season ending knee injury on a dirty hit by the opposing team’s safety. I then doubted myself and stayed home. Who’d ever heard of Kurt Warner in the 1999 NFL preseason? The odds came down be the next Sunday to less than 200-1 so it was a one shot opportunity that I blew. I would have won $47,600.00 minus a $1.75 processing fee at a Casino in Tahoe.

    • hindsight is 20/20 lawdog. I wouldn’t have bet the Dodgers to even have a winning season in 88! Let alone beat the Mets, AND the mighty mighty A’s that season. That was probably the A’s best season that year, they had a run of post season appearances around that time, but that year’s A’s team was VERY dominant all around! They had the bash brothers, plus Dave Henderson and others that could hit for power. They had Stewart and Eck, they were dominant. We had Mickey Hatcher? Who would have thought?

  33. DRomo says:

    Why would you even worry about locking Kershaw up now? He could blow out his arm, go in the tank, anything could happen. The kid will be arbitration eligable next year for the first time (maybe) and even if he has a lights out year he still won’t command more than $6-7 million or less next year. Look at the arbitration numbers and history here. If a guy like Licecum (who won back to back Cy Youngs) can break an arbitration record by getting $13 million how much would Kershaw get? Half that? To this date only Ryan Howard has ever recieved $10 million or more. And that was after be a lead leader in HRs and being an All Star twice. Clayton hasn’t been a lead leader or an All Star yet.

    What is he point? What has Clayton really accomplished yet? We all like him but, why does he deserve a raise and job security? Make him earn the money don’t just give it away.

    If you call that a slap in the face, then so be it. Clayton (and any young player) needs to earn his money first!

  34. Badger says:

    I’ll cover that bet ldog. The Dodgers are currently 9-1. Send me a thousand dollars, and if they win the WS I promise I will owe you 9 grand.

    Kershaw deserves a raise and he will get it. He did start 30 and pitch 170 innings. Yeah, he only won 8 but he put up some good stats. Over 9 K’s per 9IP, sub 3 ERA and a .200 BAA. If he does the same thing again in today’s market it’s worth $5 million or more, so, $660K doesn’t sound like much to me. They are going to ask a lot of him this year, they should pay him for what they are asking him to do.

  35. DRomo says:

    Do you guys know how arbitration works? Sure he gets a raise this year. It is in his contract but next year when he is arbitration eligable they will address his worth going foward. $5 million is about right if he performs.

    To pay a guy for what we are asking him to do, before he shows he can actually do it would be like paying Bills $15 million last year when we needed him to be a front of the rotation guy! Instead they should have charged him admission to the games in the post season.

  36. steevo17 says:

    This link is primarily for DRomo…the noted Bills-hater. Hope the explanation here will at least slow your pointed criticisms. I won’t hold my breath though.

    As for the rotation…Billingsley and Kershaw will be the “Ace” and “Ace-in Waiting” in 2010, mark my words. Therefore our main target should be reliable, inning-eating #4 and #5 starters. My first option would be to give both McDonald and Elbert honest shots at both spots. My other move would be to bring back both (if possible) Padilla and Garland. Both are proven veterans and can be had at a discount at this time of year, so close to ST.

    I’m tired of defending Billingsley (mainly from you Romo) so as of thsi date I will allow Mr. Chad Billingsley to do all my talking of the field of play. Enjoy.

  37. Badger says:

    Bills did fade somewhat last year, but, he was recovering from his leg fracture, so, I am willing to give him some slack. But this is his year. The guy is only 26 (not til July) so, this is the year he begins his prime years. If he wants the 8 figures, time to start showing he deserves it. I think he gets back to 200+ innings of 3. ERA.

    Kershaw is another story. In my pitching world, I don’t ask a 22 year old to throw 200 innings, but the Dodgers are doing just that. OK, maybe he can do that this year, but if he is to do it, he needs to stop throwing 100 pitches per 6 IP. Throw strikes young dude. You might be surprised at how difficult your pitches are to hit.

  38. Roger Dodger says:

    steevo17 – you should probably be sending those bullets to me as well.

    I have seriously questioned the use of Billingsley as the #1 or #2 for the Dodgers in 2010.

    Why? I have said it several times. He does not need to keep being matched up against other teams #1. Because he will not win many of those games.

    Example: facing the Phillies #1 (big Roy). Phillies hold the Dodgers to 3 hits 1 run over 7 innings, and C-Bills goes a hard 6 giving up 2 runs with 9 Ks — but goes out at the beginning of the 7th inning with two runners on and no outs.

    He pitched well, but was outed pitched.

    Maybe in the 8th or 9th the Dodgers explode and get 4 or 5 runs and win. Bills kept the Dodgers in the game — but from his side, he is pooped from the strain of another no decision, and pressure on every pitch.

    Where is Sandy when you need him.

  39. DRomo says:

    did Bills leg hurt in 08 too? And “Fading somewhat” is like saying Jamie McCourt is “somewhat of a floosie”. Bills tanked hard last year. After a great first half (his leg looked great then) he fell off hard.

    Bills lacks confidence in himself. It is obvious to everyone. I don’t know why people like you take offense to that. The guy has the “stuff” he lacks the guts to use it. The reason he drives me crazy is he will go 0-2 on a hitter then nibble until it is 3-2 then walk or give up BIG hits. The guy will be in the upper 90s in the pitch count before the seats are warm. He is not that young anymore. Stop using that as an excuse. If he can believe in himself to become somewhat of a mean pitcher he could be great. The ironic thing to me is his agent is Dave Stewart, who was one mean SOB! Don’t you think Stewart would kick him in the ass by now? The “Ahh Shucks” Chad Billingsley will never be a winner, he needs to pitch like a man first.

  40. Ken says:


    Did you speed read again?

    I said nothing about locking him up. I merely pointed out that he is worth more than the league minimum in 2010. All teams give a raise to their highly productive players that they want to keep past their arbitration years. Giving Kershaw a $200,000 raise for 2010 will go a long way toward encouraging him to stay after his arbitration years are over. All upper tier clubs pay more than the league minimum to the players that are projected to be stars. Not paying Kershaw more than the minimum in 2010 is a slap in the face, especially since he happens to be the closest thing to an ACE currently on the staff.

  41. DRomo says:

    Tell me what teams and what productive players Ken? He gets his raise just like any other young player. What else has he earned?

  42. Ken says:

    If I have to tell you You will never know!

  43. A Shot of Haeger says:

    Well Piniero is an Angel… 2 years 16 million, that was his first choice and he got to go there

  44. Badger says:

    Pineiro an Angel? Gee, what a surprise, we didn’t sign a FA pitcher. Next.

    2008? Not sure I follow you there Romey. He pitched 200.2 innings as a 24 year old, with an ERA of 3.14 and 201 K’s. And he was 7-2 with a 2.99 ERA post All Star. This is only his third full year as a starter and he has a winning record. Man, you are tough.

    I think he has the same problem Kershaw does and that is pitch count You are right, he throws too many pitches and that is why he is gone after 6. Once he commands the strike zone, and that should come with maturity, he should be our ace.

  45. mark says:

    … as soon as this year.

    I’m relieved that we didn’t get Pinero.


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