Categorized | Mark Timmons

The Key To Our Success Is Not Manny!

kemp-eyesAs you know, I really don’t want Manny Ramirez back.  I agree that he’s a great player, but I believe that character issues will rear their ulgy head.  To put it in perspective, we can sign Bobby Abreu, Orlando Hudson and Ben Sheets for just a few million more than Manny.   Which way do you think we would win the most games?  I think it would be with Sheets AND Abreu AND Hudson, not just Manny!  However, that won’t happen.

I am convinced that the Dodgers will not sign a Type A free agent who cost them a draft pick. That’s one reason why they stayed out of the Teixiera sweepstakes.  Hudson and Sheets will never be signed by the the Dodgers because they are Type A Free Agents who have not been offered arbitration – therefore they cost us draft picks (like the 17th in the draft).  The Dodgers are committed to signing players who cost no draft picks, so that we can continue to build from within.  SMART – VERY SMART!

Manny costs us no picks, Blake cost us nothing in picks and neither did Loretta.  Ned will contine to follow that path and I think that he will pay Manny $45 million for 2 years or Manny will walk.  End of story.  We will have Manny for 2 years or he will walk – and probably get less…

Abreu, Burrell and Dunn have not been offered arbitration, so they will cost us nothing.  Look up and see which players cost us a draft pick and I guarantee we won’t sign them – and THAT’S  VERY SMART!

The real key to our success is whether Matt Kemp can start to harness his great potential, or will he just go the way of a player like Willie Crawford?  Willie Crawford was a guy who had great skills, but somehow never could put it together.   Matt Kemp is capable of 30+ HR/120 RBI/.300 BA  and 35 SB, but will he realize his potential?  This guy is a superstar-in-waiting, but he has to come through…

If he does, whether we sign Manny or not, we will be a force to be reckoned with.

The Jones Chronicles (not good)

About Mark Timmons

When you see the invisible, you can do the impossible!

36 Responses to “The Key To Our Success Is Not Manny!”

  1. Bill Russell says:

    So if I read you correctly, it’s smart to sign Loretta and Blake but dumb to sign Hudson and Sheets because of draft picks? And don’t sign Manny because he’ll act up. I just can’t say I’m on board with ya Marky. But I’ll be a watchin what the Nedster does over the next few weeks. And no, I’m not a gangster.

    I feel sickened by the Yankees signing 3 of the top 4 free agents. The rich is getting richer. Are the republicans running baseball now? Oh well enough of that .. Peace

  2. Badger says:

    Picks schmicks. How many first rounders in the last 10 years are on this current squad?

    Manny is the best hitter out there. If he won’t be happy, then maybe you are right. A sour Manny spoils the entire bucket. But most fans want him here and he can help every hitter in our lineup. Hudson won’t do that, neither will Abreu.

    And why can’t we sign them all? We are losing Lowe, Kent, Nomar, Penny, Furcal took a pay cut and maybe we can trade Pierre if we pay a team to take him. We field a team that is competing and we will draw near 4 million. We make the play-offs and that’s money in the bank. We go to the World Series it’s more money in the bank.

    And bring the money on down to Bank of Badger, where we will give you a toasting, er… toaster for opening up an account.

  3. Mark says:

    We will have 5 1st round picks next year and 1st rounders are GOLD.

    Badger,

    We haven’t had as many first rounders because we made too many dope-fiend signings in years past, but here’s a few 1st Rounders from the past 4 years:

    Kershaw
    DeWitt
    Elbert
    Billingsley
    Loney

    Think first rounders aren’t GOLD? The A’s always have lots of 1st rounders. Look at the list of first round picks and you will see a very high percentage becaome stars.

    I WILL BE WILLING TO BET WE DON’T SIGN A FREE AGENT WHO COSTS US A PICK!

    Billy,

    Sorry, I had you pegged as a gang-banger! :smile:

  4. Bill Russell says:

    Mark,
    If we are getting two draft picks for Derek Lowe and possiblity two for Manny if he doesn’t return, why can’t we afford to sacrifice a few picks to sign Ben Sheets? Why are we collecting all these draft picks? Is there a major league rainy day that I’m not aware of? Is our farm system in trouble now and I’m not aware of it? I keep hearing that small market mentality from you and it makes me wonder why you are a Dodger fan? Wouldn’t you be better suited rooting for the Oakland A’s? They play for draft picks every year and then sell off all their good talent at the top of their game every year, collecting up and coming players and draft picks. Building the farm system is always a good idea but isn’t it all about building the major league team to be the best team you can field each year? Isn’t the major league team the one that makes the most money by drawing fans at the high ticket prices? I would think a large market team never wants to take a few years off and play for tomorrow. Like your success story Rays, How many painful years did it take for them to become the bridesmaid last year? With Free Agency availiable each year, draft picks become less important then in the past years without FA.

    Again, draft picks are important but I guess they are secondary to me to winning at the majors league level. I know most of our young raising stars came from our system but we can’t afford to waste their current value by not including some other valued plays that are major league ready now to play alone side of them. If we continue waiting for Dejesus and Lambo to become ready to help carry the team, we are looking at 3-4 years from now and who know’s if Martin, Ethier, Kemp, Loney, Billingsley and Broxton will still be on the team. Lambo and DeJesus may play in the majors in 2 years but they will need an adjustment period just like Loney, Kemp, Billingsley and Martin have gone through.
    Just my take……. And I know you don’t agree.
    Peace

  5. Bill Russell says:

    Oh by the way, Happy Birthday to me tomorrow. Sweet 53 baby….. And still a gangster..
    :mrgreen: I’ll see Manny , Mark, Romo and Badger and the Camelback Ranch in the Spring……. That’s my gift to myself…..

  6. Mark says:

    Billy,

    I don’t DISAGREE with you, but 5 draft picks are nice!

    Ideally, you want a bunch of new players EVERY year.

  7. Maddy says:

    I think the Dodgers would go after Dunn or Sheets despite losing the picks. Maybe not both, but the pick they will be getting for Lowe will make it a wash.

    Are they satisfied with Billingsley/Kershaw/Kuroda? Can’t count on Schmidt, McDonald, Elbert, or whoever.

  8. Mark says:

    Maddy,

    The D-Backs didn’t offer arbitration to Dunn, so he would not cost us a pick. Neither would Abreu or Burrell…. or Manny.

    I still believe that the Dodgers are not talking to any TYPE A FREE AGENTS who will cost them a pick. Have we been linked with Hudson or Sheets in this offseason? NEVER!

  9. Blue Haze says:

    If I were the Dodgers, and wanted to pursue ManRam (still wrong, Dromo), I would now become a real negotiator. Since no one is going after ManRam, as best as we can tell, I would now offer him 2 years at 19 mil, each. Let Borass do the work to convince the Dodgers that the original offer was good enough (2 years at $25 mil each). The Dodgers now can give a little on salary and maybe even give a vetted 3rd year. The Dodgers should negotiate from a place of strength and let Borass work from the lesser position. Borass came out with his “we will now accept serious offers” statement and now it is time him to suck hind teet. I would love to be in the room (and do the negotiating for the Dodgers) when the Dodgers start to play hardball with Borass.
    Unless a surprise bidder shows up, ManRam will be man-ramming all over Dodger Stadium this upcoming season. I can hear the Dodger brass firing up the ManRam Condom Night promotion now. Think Blue!

  10. Badger says:

    I think coming back and offering Manny less than we did before is very dangerous. If he feels forced to sign it, if he feels dissed, we may get the Manny that Boston gave away, and I wouldn’t want that.

    mover, I see two of those picks that have actually helped this squad win games to this point. Bills and Loney. The rest of those guys are still developing. Are we going to stock these picks so we can become the A’s? If that’s the plan, then let’s get that out in the open so all the fans can decide if they want to come watch the kids develop while they play .500 ball. This is L.A., a big market team that says they are in it to win it every year. I am with Bill on this one.

    I am still hopeful we will eventually get to an Opening Day squad that is favored to win the West. I don’t want to be believing we are going to wait til July and see if some team out there will give us their 100 rbi headache so we can finish strong. I want other teams chasing us all year.

  11. mark says:

    Badger,

    My point is that if you look down the list of first round picks you will find a large number of successful players AND some big busts. Up until the past 4 or 5 years, the Dodgers (a) didn’t draft well (Ben Diggins, Bubba Crosby, Glenn Davis, et al); and (b) didn’t have picks due to signing Free Agents.

    With 5 picks in the first round, you have an excellent chance of drafting a superstar.

    I just read Ken Gurnick’s column on Dodgers.com and he saif this in response to why the Dodgers didn’t attempt to sign Tex:

    It’s the same reason they haven’t bid on any Type-A free agents but their own. They are trying to develop from within. They are in a youth movement. They don’t want to give nine-figure deals to anyone. Plus, they already have a solid, inexpensive, young first baseman in James Loney.

    As much as fans don’t like hearing it, the Dodgers are a business as well as a team. That’s just reality. Current ownership has concluded that such contracts present an unwise risk/reward proposition, particularly with the unknowns of the current financial climate.

    The Dodgers traditionally are among the game’s leaders in ticket sales, allowing them a payroll annually near the top in the National League. But for another four years they will lack the riches that a regional television network provides teams like the Yankees, Mets and Red Sox. And squeezing added revenue out of a 47-year-old stadium has become a difficult challenge as well, as it requires huge capital expenditures to upgrade the venue.

    So while the Dodgers can easily outspend their smaller-market division rivals, they don’t have the resources some would expect for a club in a big market, even if they wanted to hook up in a bidding war with a free-spending rival.

    And remember, the Dodgers are in the 17th spot in the Draft, meaning if they sign a Type-A free agent from another club, that club would receive the Dodgers’ first-round pick in 2009. That is one additional disincentive for the Dodgers to sign Type-A free agents like Brian Fuentes, Ben Sheets or Oliver Perez.

  12. Mark says:

    I think Gurnick is saying the same thing I am saying – the Dodgers don’t want to lose that 17th pick!

  13. Blue Haze says:

    I didn’t say we wouldn’t sign ManRam for what we originally offered him, I said to make him a low offer. It gives you an advantageous start to the negotiating process, least of not, it sends the signal to the other party to get serious, PDQ. Game on Time, gets the blood moving and the negotiations rolling. Besides, I would love to be the guy to stick it back in Borass’ “pompous ass” face (now that’s a mouthful. Try to say “Borass’ Pompous Ass Face” tens time real quick). It would be nice to see the spin that Borass would try an paint on the negotiations.

    You have to admit it, Ned and Jedd are starting to look a little more intelligent that most gave them credit for. They knew the market and what was going to take place and stuck to their guns this off-season (maybe these two should go work on the new cabinet to guide us through these tough economic times), you got to hand it to them. Jamie McCupCheck was speaking from a position of knowledge when she spoke up a month or so ago.

  14. Gonzo says:

    Why hasn’t Ned attempted to make an offer to DLowe? Granted He’s not my favorite but he is servicable, and with him and boras overestimating his market I’d offer him a 3yr 36 million contract offer with a vesting offer for a fourth if he starts x amount of games or a 5 million buyout. The market is not there for him and we might need a pitcher or two just in case you guys haven’t noticed.

  15. Mark says:

    So, here’s the complete list of players whom we might sign:

    Catchers
    Brad Ausmus (40)
    Paul Bako (37)
    Josh Bard (31)
    Michael Barrett (32)
    Gary Bennett (37)
    Henry Blanco (37)
    Johnny Estrada (33)
    Sal Fasano (37)
    Toby Hall (33)
    Robby Hammock (32)
    Paul Lo Duca (37)
    Adam Melhuse (37)
    Ivan Rodriguez (37)
    Javier Valentin (33)
    Vance Wilson (36)
    Gregg Zaun (38)

    First basemen
    Rich Aurilia (37)
    Miguel Cairo (35)
    Sean Casey (34)
    Tony Clark (37)
    Nomar Garciaparra (35)
    Jason Giambi (38)
    Eric Hinske (31)
    Doug Mientkiewicz (35)
    Kevin Millar (37)
    Richie Sexson (34)
    Mark Sweeney (39)
    Daryle Ward (34)

    Second basemen
    Willie Bloomquist (31)
    Chris Burke (29)
    Craig Counsell (38)
    Ray Durham (37)
    Damion Easley (39)
    David Eckstein (34)
    Jerry Hairston Jr. (33)
    Tadahito Iguchi (34)
    Jeff Kent (41)
    Ramon Martinez (36)
    Aaron Miles (32)
    Pablo Ozuna (34)
    Luis Rivas (29)

    Shortstops
    Angel Berroa (31)
    Willie Bloomquist (31)
    Alex Cintron (30)
    Alex Cora (33)
    Craig Counsell (38)
    David Eckstein (34)
    Nomar Garciaparra (35)
    Chris Gomez (38)
    Jerry Hairston Jr. (33)
    Aaron Miles (32)
    Tomohiro Nioka (33)
    Luis Rivas (29)
    Juan Uribe (30)
    Omar Vizquel (42)

    Third basemen
    Rich Aurilia (37)
    Willie Bloomquist (31)
    Craig Counsell (38)
    Joe Crede (31)
    Nomar Garciaparra (35)
    Ramon Martinez (36)
    Pablo Ozuna (34)
    Juan Uribe (30)
    Ty Wigginton (31)

    Left fielders
    Moises Alou (42)
    Garret Anderson (37)
    Emil Brown (34)
    Pat Burrell (32)
    Adam Dunn (29)
    Cliff Floyd (36)
    Luis Gonzalez (41)
    Jerry Hairston Jr. (33)
    Gabe Kapler (33)
    Craig Monroe (32)
    Jay Payton (36)
    Manny Ramirez (37)
    So Taguchi (39)

    Center fielders
    Reggie Abercrombie (28)
    Rocco Baldelli (27)
    Willie Bloomquist (31)
    Jim Edmonds (39)
    Jerry Hairston Jr. (33)
    Gabe Kapler (33)
    Mark Kotsay (33)
    Scott Podsednik (33)
    So Taguchi (39)
    Willy Taveras (27)

    Right fielders
    Bobby Abreu (35)
    Emil Brown (34)
    Cliff Floyd (36)
    Jonny Gomes (28)
    Ken Griffey Jr. (39)
    Eric Hinske (31)
    Gabe Kapler (33)
    Brad Wilkerson (32)

    DHs
    Cliff Floyd (36)
    Jason Giambi (38)
    Mike Sweeney (35)
    Frank Thomas (41)
    Jose Vidro (34)

    Starting pitchers
    Matt Belisle (29)
    Kris Benson (33)
    Paul Byrd (38)
    Roger Clemens (46)
    Bartolo Colon (36)
    Shawn Estes (36)
    Josh Fogg (32)
    Freddy Garcia (33)
    Jon Garland (29)
    Tom Glavine (43)
    Charlie Haeger (25)
    Mark Hendrickson (35)
    Livan Hernandez (34)
    Orlando Hernandez (43)
    Chuck James (27)
    Jason Jennings (30)
    Randy Johnson (45)
    Kenshin Kawakami (34)
    Jon Lieber (39)
    Braden Looper (34)
    Rodrigo Lopez (33)
    Pedro Martinez (37)
    Mark Mulder (31)
    John Parrish (31)
    Carl Pavano (33)
    Odalis Perez (32)
    Andy Pettitte (37)
    Sidney Ponson (32)
    Mark Prior (27)
    Tim Redding (31)
    Kenny Rogers (44)
    Curt Schilling (42)
    John Smoltz (42)
    Koji Uehara (34)
    Kip Wells (32)
    Randy Wolf (32)

    Closers
    Chad Cordero (27)
    Brian Fuentes (33)
    Eric Gagne (33)
    Eddie Guardado (38)
    Trevor Hoffman (41)
    Jason Isringhausen (36)
    Takashi Saito (39)

    Middle relievers
    Luis Ayala (31)
    Joe Borowski (38)
    Yhency Brazoban (29)
    Chris Britton (26)
    Shawn Chacon (31)
    Lance Cormier (28)
    Elmer Dessens (37)
    Brendan Donnelly (37)
    Scott Elarton (33)
    Randy Flores (33)
    Casey Fossum (31)
    Keith Foulke (35)
    Tom Gordon (41)
    Mark Hendrickson (35)
    Matt Herges (39)
    Tyler Johnson (27)
    Wil Ledezma (28)
    Jon Lieber (39)
    Aquilino Lopez (34)
    Jason Johnson (35)
    Guillermo Mota (35)
    Joe Nelson (34)
    Will Ohman (31)
    Scott Proctor (32)
    Al Reyes (38)
    Juan Rincon (30)
    Ricardo Rincon (39)
    Rudy Seanez (40)
    Russ Springer (40)
    Ken Takahashi (41)
    Julian Tavarez (36)
    Mike Timlin (43)
    Ron Villone (39)
    Kip Wells (32)
    Matt Wise (33)
    Jamey Wright (34)

    If they are not on that list, we won’t sign them.

  16. Mark says:

    Gonzo,

    Lowe has let the Dodgers know he didn’t want to come back, so they said “Goodbye”.

    If a player doesn’t want to be here, then fine!

    He wants to stay on the East Coast…

  17. Badger says:

    But, we aren’t talking about Teixeira. He was NEVER coming here. We are talking about signing Manny.

    All I am saying is that if we are going with a youth movement, as Gurnick suggests, then let’s have the owner and G.M. come out and tell the fans. A little honesty from those in charge is something that would be welcome, by baseball fans and the entire nation for that matter. We are all long overdue for some transparency here.

    Do we need 5 picks? How about we sign a couple of arb offered FA’s and live with 3 picks? Do we lose the 17th pick if we sign Sheets or Hudson? And if so, if we have Manny, Sheets and Hudson – wouldn’t it be worth it? And, what happens if Manny goes elsewhere and we sing Abreu? Dunn wasn’t offered arb, so, if it’s about “saving all those picks” shouldn’t we go with him? He is only 29 and knocks in 100 and scores 100 every year.

    This is twisting my head around. I hope we just do something so we all know what it is we are doing.

  18. DRomo says:

    Something to think about guys. With the signing of Texeira in NY for 8 yrs that all but rules out Posada moving to first (as was expected) and Jeter moving to 1st (as is expected in a few years) Joe Torre has a close relationship with most of his former players. Could we expect these guys in some capacity in a few years? Not necessarily as players but coaches? Just a thought.

    Also with all the thought of us pursuing Dunn, Abreu, or Burrell. They all would fit nicely but we need a right handed bat to balance the lineup. Manny fit so welll between Ethier and Loney. Kemp is not selective enough to “protect” the big hitter. That leaves us with Burrell. He hit in that little league park the last few years and I don’t know if that translates to success in Dodger Stadium and parks out here like Petco or Telephone Company Stadium in SF where we play a lot of games. What about trading for Xavier Nady? NY may be willing to move him.

    About the draft picks we will lose for signing type A Free Agents, We will expect to gain a pick when Lowe signs in NY with the Mets. That is an odd signing (but I wont get into that now).

    I know how Mark feels about Manny, I agree with his reasoning but I think he is our best option. With Manny our lineup is better. He made Loney and Ethier look like the stars we now they can be. I don’t know if that happens with Dunn or Abreu. Manny needs a home and we DO need Manny. I am sure there is a middle ground we can reach with respect to the salary.

    Thats all from me. God Bless guys . Merry Christmas to you and your families. Happy Birthday BRuss. Talk to you all soon. Peace.

  19. Mark says:

    Look, Manny doesn’t cost us a draft pick, so if he’ll take the deal Ned offered with a “good conduct clause” (yes, I would demand that), the sign him. We’re much better with him than without him, IF he acts right! We are in the drivers seat with him. Maybe Ned knew all along the Yanks were going to get Tex and that the Angels didn’t want Manny, so we are the default choice. Manny can play his rear end off for two years and if he acts right, he might get another 2 or 3 year contract as a DH.

    Badger,

    If we sign ANY TYPE A free agent, we lose the 17th pick. That’s pretty high and with White and Company I think we have an opportunity to get an impact player. 5 PICKS – That’s what I want!

  20. Mark says:

    Happy Birthday,

    Billy Russ!

  21. Mark says:

    Oh, and we would lose the 17th pick if we signed Tex or Orlando Hudson, so if you are going to lose that pick, you might as well make it count. The Dodgers WILL NOT, I REPEAT WILL NOT, sign a Type A Free Agent who costs them that pick!

    FORGETABOUT!

  22. Mark says:

    Gonzo,

    It’s reported that Lowe is getting $14 – $16 mil per year over 4 years from the Mets, but the key thing is that he doesn’t want to be in LA!

  23. Bill Russell says:

    Thanks for the Birthday wishes guys. I was just wondering if you’re not picking in the top 10-15 players in the draft, is that 17th overall pick really that important? I’m sure we will hear success stories of players being drafted later then 17th overall but I would want a top 10 pick to get truely excited over.
    Get it done Ned and Franky, bring us Manny for Christmas. Tie a very tight bow around his neck.

    :mrgreen:

  24. Badger says:

    Personally, I would trade that 17th pick for Hudson, as long as Hudson passed a physical. But that’s just me. I am tired of wating. I passed 53 several years ago (Happy B-Day Bill) and it’s been a long time since we were in the World Series. And to think we are going to be stalling until the McCheaps get their t.v. package is not acceptable to me. Raise the darn ticket prices, sell the naming rights to Chavez and put up more ads around the park I don’t care. Just sign a slugger and a 211 inning 3.24 ERA 1.13 WHIP (Lowe’s numbers) starting pitcher and let’s have a shot at the ring.

    But if we are going to go with a youth movement tell me now so I won’t think THIS is the year and end up saying “wait til next year” over and over.

  25. mark says:

    Badger,

    I agree with you… to a point! However, I think everyone missed the major point of today’s blog: our youngsters are no longer YOUNGSTERS. They are seasoned. Unless you are Ethier bashers like me, who thinks it’s not likely that Andre won’t bat .300 with 25 to 30 HR? Who thinks Loney won’t get better (and he’s already pretty good)? Who thinks Russ Martin won’t work harder and play less to get better? Who thinks Billingsley and Broxton and Kershaw and McDonald aren’t ready to step even more? Blake DeWitt was first-round pick and FINALLY he’s living up to his potential – who thinks he can’t be as good as Casey Blake? And finally, who thinks it’s possible that the Bison can really become a BISON? My point is, young player who show they can play (and all of the above players have shown they are players) usually get better every year. It’s called “understanding.”

    I have the CONFIDENCE that our young players will be even better next year. I have the BELIEF that Jason Schmidt will earn his keep for one year and I have the HOPE that Andruw Jones can comeback (that’s a stretch). Even without Manny, we are favorites to win the West next year. The key thing is: DON’T MAKE ANY DOPE-FIEND MOVES!

    Here’s a partial list of first-rounders taken at 15 or lower (I figured that 15 and below is about the same as 17, depending upon who is drafting):

    Jacoby Ellsbury
    Colby Rasmus
    Conner Jackson
    Chad Codero
    Carlos Quinten
    Cole Hamels
    Matt Cain
    Noan Lowrey
    Chase Utley
    Alex Rios
    Brad Lidge
    CC Sabathia
    Lance Berkman
    Jason Werth
    Gil Menche
    Roy Halladay
    Torii Hunter

    Shall I go on?

    Look, I like Hudson, but how much of an improvement over DeWitt would he be? Can we be sure of that? I believe that DeWitt will play a good 2B and hot .260+ with 15+ HR. He gets timely hits and while that’s not as good as Hudson is it worth $38 milllion AND a player like CC Sabathia (potentially) to sign Hudson.

    Again, it’s a numbers game and the more first round picks you have the better the opportunity to get a superstar.

    Also, let’s hope that Matt Kemp can really grow next year. As BAD as a lot of you say he was he hit .290 with 18 HR, 78 RBI, 38 Doubles and 35 SB while he struck out 153 times. He also walked 46 times. If he can just up his walks by just 10% and cut down his K’s by the same number, he might be on his way to stardom.

    Have faith my friends.

  26. lawdog says:

    A Christmas baby! I’ll bet your parents think God has a diabolical sense of humor! Being a Capricorn that close to it’s cusp with Sagitarius usually makes for a stubborn workingman who knows his trade well but has this irritating need to tell everyone else exactly what they should do in almost any situation. :shock:

    Of course this would modified greatly by your moon sign, other aspects and positioning of your houses but you probably were a difficult child who even “sassed” his parents and told them what to do–and you were probably right most of the time which makes you that much m ore irritating. :mad:

    The perfect job your other aspects are in harmony? Probably shortstop for the Los Angeles Dodgers and later–manager of the team. ;)

  27. lawdog says:

    I’m with Badger and Bruss on the draft pick/FA issue. Draft picks are important enough not to waste by signing washed up geezers–but this is not the NFL where first, second and even third round picks are golden and hoarded when possible. You only get 5-7 years out of most players and except for qbs, most players are ready to play by their second seasons.

    In baseball, first round picks bomb more often than they become stars–particularly pitchers who usually need Tommy John surgery after about 3 years in the minors. Great position players in high school and college get al lot of mistakes to hit hard coming up. When they hit the majors they suddenly discover they can’t hit a well placed change up, curve or slider after watching fastballs with great late movement whizz by them before they can get the bat off their shoulders. :shock:

    Draft picks also cost you millions in bonus money when they’re first rounders. I’ll bet you don’t see a disproportionate number of first rounders as opposed to non-first rounders in the bigs. Seems to me there are a lot 35th rounders who turn into quality players. :mrgreen:

    Don’t throw away the picks. But I’d just as soon have Sheets in the rotation and go with 4 first rounders as opposed to going with 5 first rounders without him. Or do we lose more than one pick per FA signing if they were tendered and are considered a top tiered player.

  28. Badger says:

    Now put together a list of All Star players taken after the first round.

    And since you asked I’ll answer.

    I don’t know how good these kids will be.

    I will agree it is quite possible Bills, Loney and Ethier will be great players very soon. It is also quite possible they will do what they did last year – and those were pretty good numbers. Bills won 16, Loney knocked in 90 Ethier hit .305, Martin hit .280 (and faded again) and it still took Manny to get this team over .500.

    I don’t know if Kershaw is ready yet. Maybe. I don’t know if Martin has matured. Maybe. I don’t know if Kemp has his head out of his ass. Maybe. I don’t know if Blake DeWitt will ever hit .300 (like Hudson did). Maybe. I have no idea if McDonald is ready. Maybe. Let me add here that I still think Kershaw, McDonald and DeWitt should spend one more year in the minors.

    You have been the optimist about these issues since I have known you, which is about 10 years now.

    I am on record as saying I don’t much for the Boston McCourts and I don’t care much for the S.F. Giant trained Colletti. But, we are currently stuck with them. I just hope they have learned from their mistakes and will do what it is the power teams do to stay competitive.

    Spend the money, sign a power hitter and get a pitcher to replace Lowe. Make the trades that will get players who are ready for break out years, not bust years.

    Let’s get this thing right.

  29. lawdog says:

    YANKS SIGNING MANNY !!!

    6 years $181 million to rich for Fred’s blood. Frank’s wife threatens a divorce if McCourt over bids now.

    According to my cousin Vinny’s luke-warm stove report–the deal is all but done. Manny’s demanding that A-Rod set him up with a date with Madonna and then the fat lady (Steinbrenner’s wife) will commence to sing.

    George is planning to field the first billion dollar roster. :shock:

    Ned, Fred and Frank could have signed him for 2 years $50 million with a vesting 3rd year at 22 million if Manny hit .300 with 30 hrs and 100 rbis.

    Instead, Pierre is being given a 25 million dollar extension which will keep him with the Dogs through 2014–insuring that he’ll patrol the outfield for them until he’s ready for that wheelchair. There’s even a clause in the deal requiring the Dodgers to buy him a “scooter”–an electrically driven wheel chair to use in the outfield when his knees fail him in a year or two.

    Vinny is a rumor monger–but he’s always right on! :mrgreen:

  30. Gonzo says:

    Well I read that Lowe would be open to coming back to the Dodgers. IIRC, he said something like “it’s easy to turn down nothing” I don’t know if he was blowing smoke out of his ass or what but this far in the game Ned has to at least try. Hell, I’d even try to resign Penny to a 1 year deal.

  31. Bill Russell says:

    It sounds like Lowe is wrapping up a deal with the Mets. So long my friend.

    However it’s time to investigate a trade with the Bluejays. Toronto is not going anywhere next year and should finish 4 at best behind the Yankee’s , Red Sox and Rays. Halliday, Wells or Rios won’t make a difference to them this year. Even with these three guys, they will still finish no higher then 4th. They should take Marks advice and sell high making a trade with the Dodgers.

    Something like
    McDonald, Kemp, DeJesus,Paul,Pierre for Halladay and Wells. Or any package along these lines with us only giving up one of our young outfielders for an Ace pitcher and Power hitter. Any thoughts??? :mrgreen:

  32. mark says:

    Badger,

    I am an optimist, but I also am a realist. The reality is that we are a big market team without the revenue of the Big Market teams. I also know that we have some of the best young talent in the game. That’s not just what I say. It’s what scouts, GM’s and managers all over baseball say.

    Our future is bright.

    Gonzo,

    Google “Lowe Returning to Dodgers and you’ll get the sense he didn’t want to although there are no direct quotes.

    Billy,

    The combined ages of all the palyer you suggest trading are less than that of Halladay and Wells…

    :smile:

  33. Bill Russell says:

    Halladay 31
    Wells 30
    If my math is right thats 61

    McDonald 15
    Kemp 15
    DeJesus 10
    Paul 10
    Pierre 10

    Mark you are right if my math is correct 60

    :mrgreen:

  34. Mark says:

    You are off. Kemp is 13

  35. Gonzo says:

    If were to trade with TOR I’d trade for Rios instead of wells and I’d include ethier or Lambo instead of kemp

  36. Santa says:

    Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night

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